SPEAKER_2: Welcome, please have a seat.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, thank you, thanks.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I'll just sit here.
SPEAKER_2: So, I see that you've come in today, we're going to talk about some of your problems you've been having with, it says here, cravings.
SPEAKER_2: You've been having a cravings addiction.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I don't know that I call it addiction, it's complicated, it's like cravings, and I think it's, you know.
SPEAKER_2: Do you think about cravings on a daily basis?
SPEAKER_1: Oh, yeah, you could say that.
SPEAKER_2: How does that make you feel?
SPEAKER_1: Oh, it kind of makes me want to like, kind of makes me want to record a podcast or something about them.
SPEAKER_2: Do you want to share our cravings?
SPEAKER_1: I think that would be very good.
SPEAKER_2: I am your therapist today, I am Dr.
SPEAKER_2: Ross, certified therapist, and you are my therapy, my therapy, theropi, theropi-ster?
SPEAKER_2: No, theropized, theropized.
SPEAKER_2: You are my theropized.
SPEAKER_1: Hi, I'm Brianna, no last names, please.
SPEAKER_2: While Brianna, no last names, please.
SPEAKER_2: Is that two names or one name?
SPEAKER_1: It's all one name.
SPEAKER_2: It's all one name.
SPEAKER_1: That's how you have to refer to me from now on.
SPEAKER_2: We'll miss no last names, please, please.
SPEAKER_1: Please.
SPEAKER_1: Mononym.
SPEAKER_2: What is one of these cravings?
SPEAKER_2: I would like to hear more about them.
SPEAKER_1: So, it's kind of complicated to talk about this one because I'm craving craving something.
SPEAKER_1: I want to crave something.
SPEAKER_1: I want to crave writing.
SPEAKER_2: So you're not craving craving, you're craving writing?
SPEAKER_1: I'm craving.
SPEAKER_2: Oh.
SPEAKER_1: Wanting to, I want to crave writing.
SPEAKER_2: Are you struggling with writer's block?
SPEAKER_1: It's difficult because it's not writer's block in that I don't know what to write.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I have lots of ideas of what's fun to write.
SPEAKER_1: And sometimes I get to underwrite them, I'm like, oh yeah, this is fun.
SPEAKER_1: But a lot of the time I'm like, I don't even think about it.
SPEAKER_1: I don't crave it.
SPEAKER_1: I don't need it in the way that I want to need it, you know?
SPEAKER_1: Cause if I don't need it, then I don't do it.
SPEAKER_1: Cause there's a lot of other things for me to be doing that are more important.
SPEAKER_1: And therefore I get no writing done.
SPEAKER_1: I want to want to write.
SPEAKER_2: So is this about the lack of serotonin produced when you write, or is this like giving yourself time and like finding the time to sit down and just write?
SPEAKER_1: A little bit of both.
SPEAKER_1: The thing that it is, is you have to be in a certain zone.
SPEAKER_2: The writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: I'm familiar with the writing zone.
SPEAKER_1: The writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: I frequently very often.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's easier to write if you're in the writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: We've all gone to the subliminal space that is the writing zone.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, we've all gone there.
SPEAKER_2: Where ideas live.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, and I'm having a little bit of trouble getting into the writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: Well, how are we gonna get into the writing zone?
SPEAKER_1: I don't know, do we break in?
SPEAKER_1: Is that how the writing zone works?
SPEAKER_1: Clair, I think you know a little bit more about the writing zone than I do, clearly.
SPEAKER_1: Can you tell me, how do we get into the writing zone?
SPEAKER_2: That's a little tricky, because I actually, I locked my door.
SPEAKER_2: I threw away the key, actually, just last weekend.
SPEAKER_2: Well, I was like, you know what?
SPEAKER_2: I think I'm done writing in my life.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, so you just had decided, hmm, I don't think I'm ever going to write again for the rest of my life.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, I thought, you know, maybe I'll just speak and then, you know, I'll just remember everything I say from that point forward.
SPEAKER_2: I just thought, you know, I don't need my writing zone key anymore, so I returned it to the library.
SPEAKER_2: But that's the thing, is once you check the key out of the library, it's one checkout per lifetime.
SPEAKER_1: Oh.
SPEAKER_2: So I think I'm done.
SPEAKER_2: I think I can't write anymore.
SPEAKER_1: Huh, well, I'm glad I checked my key back in.
SPEAKER_1: That would be bad.
SPEAKER_1: Now, hypothetically, if one had checked their key back in, but still wanted to write because they didn't realize it was a once a lifetime thing, how would one get into the writing zone in that case?
SPEAKER_2: Does crossing out every second word in a book in order to create your own sort of story count as writing?
SPEAKER_1: I would say yes.
SPEAKER_2: Well, then maybe-
SPEAKER_1: That's called blackout poetry.
SPEAKER_2: So maybe we can create like a side door, right?
SPEAKER_2: We take a book that we like and love and cherish very closely.
SPEAKER_2: It's a very important ingredient.
SPEAKER_2: And we destroy it by like creating our own story.
SPEAKER_2: Because then it's not really, I'm not like writing, I'm like, I'm subwriting, which is definitely a real word.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, so we have to take a book that we really cherish and appreciate, but still want to destroy.
SPEAKER_1: Harry Potter.
SPEAKER_1: Uh.
SPEAKER_1: I don't cherish it.
SPEAKER_1: I don't cherish either, but.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, at one time in my life, I definitely cherished Harry Potter.
SPEAKER_2: We can't half-ass this, right?
SPEAKER_2: Like, what if the door is only like a foot tall?
SPEAKER_2: We're never gonna get in there.
SPEAKER_2: Harry Potter's time has come.
SPEAKER_2: Harry Potter's been buried in the ground for years now.
SPEAKER_1: Clair, we just have to go back in time to when we cared about Harry Potter, steal the book from the version of me that cared about Harry Potter, which would actually be great, because then I probably wouldn't have given a shit about Harry Potter much later that I wish I had stopped caring.
SPEAKER_2: But this would create a time-continuum rift because now you wouldn't care about Harry Potter.
SPEAKER_2: So do we have to talk about, are we in the fiction of where time travel creates new timelines or affects the current timeline?
SPEAKER_1: What's the correct time travel?
SPEAKER_1: Is this back to the future or is this end game?
SPEAKER_2: I think the answer is irrelevant because what if we make zombie Harry Potter because he's already in the ground and now we can just revive him?
SPEAKER_1: The problem is we need to care about the book.
SPEAKER_2: What if it's our book?
SPEAKER_2: What if we're making it good?
SPEAKER_2: What if we're stealing the IP and now it's our IP?
SPEAKER_2: Okay, so we have to write first in order to enter the writing.
SPEAKER_1: So I do see the problem.
SPEAKER_1: I was going to say I do see a slight issue which is fan fiction.
SPEAKER_2: There has to be a zombie fan fiction.
SPEAKER_1: Could fan fiction simply provide us a back door into the writing zone?
SPEAKER_2: I think so, right?
SPEAKER_2: It's sort of like the 4chan of the writing zone.
SPEAKER_1: I, no, no, no, I, no.
SPEAKER_1: It is, well, yeah, sure, fan fiction can be racist, but I don't think it's that racist.
SPEAKER_1: Eh, yeah, it can't, yeah.
SPEAKER_2: So maybe, maybe-
SPEAKER_1: When taken as a whole, it's not as bad as 4chan taken as a whole.
SPEAKER_1: I just want to put that out there.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe we don't have to go into the writing zone the conventional way.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe there is something that we're missing.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe we bring the writing zone to us.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe we make the writing zone come into the real world.
SPEAKER_2: What if we fill the real world with writing inspiration and we populate this world with ideas?
SPEAKER_2: How do we get a big enough knife to do this?
SPEAKER_1: Like a time knife?
SPEAKER_2: No, like a writing knife, like a pencil.
SPEAKER_2: A pencil, it's just a pencil, it's just a big-ass pencil.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, so it's the SpongeBob episode where they create DoodleBob.
SPEAKER_2: Thank you.
SPEAKER_1: We got there.
SPEAKER_1: In order to infiltrate the writing zone, we simply me hoi, me noi.
SPEAKER_1: This makes a lot of sense.
SPEAKER_1: It doesn't, but it's true.
SPEAKER_2: How did that come?
SPEAKER_2: What happened?
SPEAKER_1: Did he just have like a pencil that made?
SPEAKER_1: Someone was in a boat, they dropped a pencil and then it gained magical powers.
SPEAKER_2: So we just have to submerge a pencil into water?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that makes sense to me.
SPEAKER_2: So this is the aqua pencil.
SPEAKER_1: Yes.
SPEAKER_2: It writes underwater.
SPEAKER_1: But can't write.
SPEAKER_2: Is that the gateway into the writing zone is underwater?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I mean, it's gotta have a moat around it, right?
SPEAKER_2: A moat?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, the writing zone has a moat around it.
SPEAKER_2: Like filled with words?
SPEAKER_1: And filled with water.
SPEAKER_1: That's how we're gonna get there.
SPEAKER_2: I thought it was just gonna be like a moat of very difficult to pronounce words.
SPEAKER_2: Oh no, I can't cross.
SPEAKER_2: I'm gonna have to say, a grogius five times fast.
SPEAKER_2: And like, I can't do that.
SPEAKER_1: It'll just, it's a lot of them will be medication names.
SPEAKER_1: Try saying, try saying methylphenidate times five, five times fast.
SPEAKER_2: Times five fast.
SPEAKER_1: Times five fast.
SPEAKER_1: At times five speed.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe you have to like complete a game, right?
SPEAKER_2: So like, have you seen the like, is it a, is it a Pokemon name or is it a medication name?
SPEAKER_2: And it's like, it's like the Sphinx guards the writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: What is the writing zone Sphinx riddle?
SPEAKER_1: One of us always writes and the other never writes.
SPEAKER_2: The secret is, it's not a secret.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: What does the writing Sphinx look like?
SPEAKER_2: Do they have glasses?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's like a Sphinx, but a library.
SPEAKER_2: Are they still a cat?
SPEAKER_2: Are they still a human cat?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: So they like just have bow tie and glasses and they should go swingy.
SPEAKER_1: And like their hair is up in a bun.
SPEAKER_1: Oh my God.
SPEAKER_1: Very cute.
SPEAKER_1: So we just have to go up to the Sphinx, find out which one writes and which one never writes.
SPEAKER_2: So wait, are there two Sphinxes?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: Sphinxite, what's the plural of Sphinx?
SPEAKER_1: Sphinx.
SPEAKER_2: So the Sphinxite are a...
SPEAKER_1: I think it's just Sphinx.
SPEAKER_1: Sphincter?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, the Sphincter, that's it.
SPEAKER_1: That's the plural of Sphinx, is Sphincter.
SPEAKER_1: So the Sphincter are...
SPEAKER_2: Look, it makes sense, cause one of them holds back information and the other one does other things of a similar vein of holding back.
SPEAKER_1: They both hold back information.
SPEAKER_1: That's the whole thing.
SPEAKER_1: So what's the question that we're gonna ask the Sphincter to find out which one lies, which one tells the truth and therefore get into the writing zone?
SPEAKER_2: Are we answering the riddle?
SPEAKER_2: Are we asking them a question?
SPEAKER_2: Are we just trying to one up them?
SPEAKER_2: Is that what the writing zone is about?
SPEAKER_2: It's just one upping each other.
SPEAKER_1: So you just have to ask them better questions.
SPEAKER_1: Yes, it's not absolutely that.
SPEAKER_1: Have you, that's the history of writing is, yeah, this is all right, but I bet I could do it better.
SPEAKER_1: That's the history of writing.
SPEAKER_2: If you answer the question they ask, they eat you.
SPEAKER_2: That's not what you're supposed to do.
SPEAKER_1: You're supposed to ask them better questions.
SPEAKER_1: So the question that they ask is, what is the core of writing?
SPEAKER_2: And we of course say in response, Why does anyone want to know about the core of the writing?
SPEAKER_2: What does it mean to be the core of the writing?
SPEAKER_1: And then their heads blow up and we're in the writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: This is quite the roundabout way.
SPEAKER_2: And we can just like come back out, right?
SPEAKER_2: Like, are you just, we're just going to go in and you're going to like write, you're just going to like 10 books in like the span of, does time work the same way?
SPEAKER_1: No.
SPEAKER_2: Cool.
SPEAKER_1: I don't know how it works, but it certainly doesn't work the same way.
SPEAKER_1: When you're in that writing zone, oh man, time just like flies by.
SPEAKER_1: So it may actually end up taking longer than usual, but you don't need to eat, sleep or drink.
SPEAKER_2: Oh my God.
SPEAKER_1: But only when you're in the writing zone.
SPEAKER_2: And you're still dehydrated at the end of it.
SPEAKER_2: You just don't have to do it.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, you still feel pretty fucking bad, but you sure are in the writing zone.
SPEAKER_1: We did it.
SPEAKER_1: Now I can write.
SPEAKER_2: Thanks, Clair.
SPEAKER_2: I look forward to reading all of these books you're gonna write now.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, thanks.
SPEAKER_1: So do I.
SPEAKER_1: Now I know this section is about me, but what are you craving?
SPEAKER_2: I know the therapist isn't normally supposed to answer this, so.
SPEAKER_1: They're forbidden.
SPEAKER_2: The forbidden knowledge.
SPEAKER_2: We did touch on this a bit last time.
SPEAKER_1: It's fine.
SPEAKER_1: No one listens to these episodes in order.
SPEAKER_2: It's a strong assumption.
SPEAKER_1: It's a very strong assumption that is false.
SPEAKER_2: I've been rereading Heroes of Olympus.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: I've been craving getting back into the Rick Riordan sort of series and rereading Percy Jackson again, but Riordan has-
SPEAKER_1: Riordan.
SPEAKER_2: Riordan?
SPEAKER_2: How do you say his name?
SPEAKER_1: Riordan.
SPEAKER_2: Riordan?
SPEAKER_2: You got to reorder the din.
SPEAKER_1: Reorder the din.
SPEAKER_2: I've always called him Riordan or Riordan.
SPEAKER_1: This feels like an obscure Fire Emblem character.
SPEAKER_2: This is my main character, Riordan.
SPEAKER_1: We got Byleth, we got Edelgard, and we got Royaldin.
SPEAKER_2: I'm pretty sure it's Edelgard.
SPEAKER_1: I have no idea which it is.
SPEAKER_2: I like Edelgard though.
SPEAKER_1: Why would I know anything about Fire Emblem?
SPEAKER_1: We've never played a single goddamn game.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, it's pretty, Edelgard.
SPEAKER_1: So-
SPEAKER_1: Edel-gurd.
SPEAKER_1: What?
SPEAKER_1: Edelgurd.
SPEAKER_2: Edelgurd.
SPEAKER_2: This is my Finnish Fire Emblem game.
SPEAKER_2: I am-
SPEAKER_1: Finnish Emblem.
SPEAKER_1: I am Edelgard.
SPEAKER_2: I want to start a massive war against the other nations.
SPEAKER_2: This is how Swedish people talk.
SPEAKER_2: It's always with an up and down reflection.
SPEAKER_1: You should finish saying you're crazy.
SPEAKER_1: But I used to do this voice forever.
SPEAKER_2: I'm just going to say Riordan, because I've called him Riordan for my entire life.
SPEAKER_1: I will continue saying Riordan.
SPEAKER_2: I'm going to call him Rick.
SPEAKER_2: You know, hey Rick, my buddy Rick.
SPEAKER_1: Hey, so Rick made these books, right?
SPEAKER_1: They're certainly something.
SPEAKER_2: So I really enjoyed reading these books as a kid.
SPEAKER_2: We previously talked about this, but the original series was about the Greek gods.
SPEAKER_2: The next series was about in the same universe, the Roman gods, and then I believe there was the Egyptian gods.
SPEAKER_1: Well, the Egyptian gods, he wrote that series between the Greek and the Roman ones.
SPEAKER_1: I've read that trilogy.
SPEAKER_1: I liked it a lot when I read it.
SPEAKER_1: I don't know how good it is, you know, with the knowledge of like...
SPEAKER_2: I mean, with time and like, this is why I want to revisit it.
SPEAKER_2: I want to see if it stands up because Rick has often been praised as someone who like grew as a writer over the course of the book series with diversity in his writing.
SPEAKER_2: The beginning of the Percy Jackson series was sort of your cliche hero's story.
SPEAKER_2: Hero's story story.
SPEAKER_2: And then we get cool characters like Thalia and Rico?
SPEAKER_2: Nico?
SPEAKER_1: Nico.
SPEAKER_1: Nico D'Ange.
SPEAKER_2: This is why I need to reread the books because I'm forgetting all these neat characters.
SPEAKER_2: But my craving is more of these modern day interpretations of mythological figures.
SPEAKER_2: And so I want to ask, what mythological figures would you want in modern day?
SPEAKER_2: What is the story?
SPEAKER_1: Um, okay, okay, let's...
SPEAKER_2: It can just be one mythological figure.
SPEAKER_1: Let's...
SPEAKER_1: Are you good?
SPEAKER_1: There's a lot to choose from.
SPEAKER_1: And I feel like...
SPEAKER_1: I know my answer, but first I do want to shout out something.
SPEAKER_2: What's your answer?
SPEAKER_1: My answer is Achilles and Patroclus.
SPEAKER_2: I don't even know who Patroclus is.
SPEAKER_2: Who do you want to shout out?
SPEAKER_2: What do you want to shout out?
SPEAKER_1: The thing that I wanted to shout out is a play called Jasper in Deadland, which is a musical about sort of a modern interpretation of the story of Orpheus and Eurydice.
SPEAKER_1: I think that's how you pronounce that name.
SPEAKER_1: And the original musical, that's fine.
SPEAKER_1: But I once saw a version of it that was gay, and that was extremely good.
SPEAKER_1: It was about someone going into the underworld to save her best friend and slowly realizing that she was in love with this girl.
SPEAKER_1: It's extremely good.
SPEAKER_2: Knowing the ending of that story, that must have been a heartbreaking story.
SPEAKER_1: No, no, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_1: It goes different.
SPEAKER_1: Because it's like they mention in the play that like, Oh yeah, Orpheus tried this once.
SPEAKER_1: It didn't go well for him.
SPEAKER_1: Good luck.
SPEAKER_1: Things do not play out exactly on the myth.
SPEAKER_2: I will say in Portrait of a Lady on Fire, there is a lot of themes with this myth in that movie.
SPEAKER_2: And you've seen this movie, right?
SPEAKER_1: I haven't yet.
SPEAKER_1: I want to see it.
SPEAKER_2: But yeah, no, I love this myth.
SPEAKER_2: It's such a good myth.
SPEAKER_1: The other myth that I want to do is Achilles and Patroclus.
SPEAKER_1: So everyone knows about Achilles heel, right?
SPEAKER_1: Everyone knows about Achilles heel.
SPEAKER_2: I love his little heel.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, his heel where you could hurt him.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, and all of his life is in his heel.
SPEAKER_2: He has no soul except for in his heel.
SPEAKER_2: And therefore, when he takes an arrow to the knee, it's not the knee.
SPEAKER_1: It's the heel.
SPEAKER_1: But yeah, no.
SPEAKER_2: What if Achilles took an arrow to the knee instead?
SPEAKER_1: The story of Achilles is Achilles is this powerful Greek fighter who's like part of the group.
SPEAKER_2: He's a mortal, right?
SPEAKER_2: He's not immortal.
SPEAKER_2: He is a mortal.
SPEAKER_1: He is the he's a demigod.
SPEAKER_2: I thought he started out as mortal and then got dipped in the river.
SPEAKER_1: He got dipped in by his mother, who is, I think, like a godly figure.
SPEAKER_1: She's not a god, but she is a godly figure.
SPEAKER_1: And he was one of the most powerful members of the Grecian army when they were assaulting Troy.
SPEAKER_1: He kind of lets power go to his head and takes his troops away from the assault of Troy until they give him his power back.
SPEAKER_1: There's a whole bunch of infighting among the Greeks.
SPEAKER_1: Then in a final battle, they end up taking Troy.
SPEAKER_1: Achilles is killed.
SPEAKER_1: Leaving behind, this is a part of the myth that is not often told about Achilles, his partner, Patroclus, who's also a boy.
SPEAKER_1: Or no, it's Patroclus who dies first.
SPEAKER_1: So I read The Song of Achilles, which is where I know this from most recently, which is an excellent book, very sad.
SPEAKER_1: But in that version of the story, Patroclus, like, he pretends to be Achilles because Achilles won't do anything and like ends up getting killed.
SPEAKER_1: And then Achilles like goes on a fucking rampage, kills most people and then ends up dying himself.
SPEAKER_1: It's a very sad story.
SPEAKER_1: What if it wasn't?
SPEAKER_2: What if we combine these myths and then also set it in modern day?
SPEAKER_2: Where like it's this modern war of Achilles.
SPEAKER_2: What if Achilles dies and what was the partner's name again?
SPEAKER_1: Petroclus.
SPEAKER_2: Petroclus doesn't.
SPEAKER_2: What if that whole thing doesn't happen and Petroclus goes to hell to get Achilles back in modern day setting.
SPEAKER_2: But like the doors to hell are, and I'm probably stealing this from Percy Jackson, are like in New York or something.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that's extremely good.
SPEAKER_2: I've changed my mind a little bit.
SPEAKER_2: I don't just want modern day.
SPEAKER_2: I want like close modern day, but modern future.
SPEAKER_1: It's slight future.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, it's like 50 to 100 years in the future.
SPEAKER_2: It's modern day.
SPEAKER_1: The first chapter is Achilles dying.
SPEAKER_1: Achilles dies in the first chapter.
SPEAKER_2: What if we don't even see him dying?
SPEAKER_2: What if like the first chapter is the funeral?
SPEAKER_1: Oh, I like this.
SPEAKER_2: And like it starts with anger, right?
SPEAKER_2: Because what is Patriculus?
SPEAKER_1: Petroclus.
SPEAKER_1: So his name is Patriculus now?
SPEAKER_1: It's Pat, Pat or Petriculus.
SPEAKER_1: Everyone just calls him Pat.
SPEAKER_2: Everyone calls him Pat, but his name is Petriculus.
SPEAKER_2: Pat, he has an older brother that calls him Trickle.
SPEAKER_2: You trickle your pants there, Patty.
SPEAKER_2: They're from Boston.
SPEAKER_2: They have to go to New York.
SPEAKER_1: That was New York.
SPEAKER_2: Was it?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, but it's fine.
SPEAKER_2: We're very good at hacktimes.
SPEAKER_1: We are.
SPEAKER_1: Throughout the story, as Petroculus like goes through the underworld, you get kind of flashbacks of what their life was like before.
SPEAKER_1: And it's like, as he's searching for Achilles, you're also hearing the story of how this war came about and how Achilles like got involved in this.
SPEAKER_1: At least in the song, Achilles is one of the things that really gets me is like, he didn't want to be involved in this war, but he was like forced to.
SPEAKER_2: What if we changed it?
SPEAKER_2: What if he didn't have to be involved with the war, but he felt like he had to?
SPEAKER_2: And that was like a big falling out point.
SPEAKER_2: And then that's like a conflict resolution that comes up in the last part.
SPEAKER_2: It's like, yeah, I saved you, you asshole.
SPEAKER_2: You could have not done this.
SPEAKER_2: We could have avoided all of this.
SPEAKER_1: And what if it's kind of unclear throughout most of the time what the war is about, but then in the end you kind of find out that like, what if this was like a revolution?
SPEAKER_2: Absolutely.
SPEAKER_1: And like you find out in the end that what Patroclus wanted to do was like ignore the revolutionary call.
SPEAKER_2: Oh.
SPEAKER_1: And Achilles wanted to fight for this thing that they cared about.
SPEAKER_2: Some of my favorite themes are like surviving in the age of war.
SPEAKER_2: And so like, where is our resolution?
SPEAKER_2: Is it them being like, you've already died for this war.
SPEAKER_2: Like, can we just live our lives?
SPEAKER_2: Or is it left as a bigger question?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I'm a huge fan of leaving things as questions.
SPEAKER_1: I like the idea that like the last moment of the book is like they escape.
SPEAKER_1: What are they going to do now?
SPEAKER_2: What if Achilles is also just like, I don't like, I can't go back.
SPEAKER_1: That's, that's, yo, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_1: In the original myth, Orpheus can't bear to not check on your DC and make sure she's doing okay.
SPEAKER_1: Because you have to go through this whole like set of like waves and stuff.
SPEAKER_1: And it's like bad Orpheus like can't bear to not look back and looks back.
SPEAKER_1: And then they're both trapped there forever.
SPEAKER_1: I think the point here is that this is sick.
SPEAKER_1: But I do like this idea of like when they're escaping, they're having this argument as they get out.
SPEAKER_2: This is the final argument.
SPEAKER_2: I really love the idea of the shot where we see both their faces because the shot is from in front of them and we don't see them exiting, but we do see light getting brighter and brighter on their face.
SPEAKER_2: The shot is just one continuous shot of both of their faces, one behind the other.
SPEAKER_2: You can see their expressions, but they can't see each other's expressions.
SPEAKER_2: They're just having this probably 10-minute-long monologue.
SPEAKER_2: That's the last big scene before they get out, but that's it.
SPEAKER_2: That's the movie.
SPEAKER_2: This is cool.
SPEAKER_1: Someone let us make movies.
SPEAKER_2: Someone, grant us millions of dollars so we can make movies.
SPEAKER_1: Someone just let us make some movies because we would make some sick movies.
SPEAKER_1: Salt Cravings movie company win.
SPEAKER_2: That's what I've been craving, is more modern adaptations of mythological figures.
SPEAKER_1: I love me some modern adaptations, mythologies and stuff.
SPEAKER_1: I think it's a lot of fun to be like, okay, well, what does this mean in modern times?
SPEAKER_1: I like a lot of the complications of Ole Miss.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, these people kind of suck.
SPEAKER_1: Sometimes your characters can suck.
SPEAKER_1: Percy Jackson tones down how much the characters suck, and they still suck a lot.
SPEAKER_1: But like in Percy Jackson, it's more that they are just like terrible parents as opposed to the actual myths, which is like really bad.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, Zeus and Percy Jackson is a fucking saint compared to the original myths.
SPEAKER_2: What have you been craving?
SPEAKER_1: I was getting back to you.
SPEAKER_2: You know, the real reason we're here.
SPEAKER_1: Right.
SPEAKER_1: This is also kind of related to movies and adaptations.
SPEAKER_1: There is a song called In the Hall of the Mountain King.
SPEAKER_1: I love In the Hall of the Mountain King.
SPEAKER_1: I think it is absolutely my favorite piece of classical music.
SPEAKER_1: And it's just, I love it.
SPEAKER_1: And I love when it is used in pieces of media.
SPEAKER_2: This throws me back to like high school.
SPEAKER_2: I think there was just a year where I got really into every adaptation of Hall of the Mountain King.
SPEAKER_1: There's a lot of really good uses of it in media.
SPEAKER_1: Pose uses it at the end of one of its episodes.
SPEAKER_1: It's used in everything from Pose to the MbimBam TV show.
SPEAKER_1: And I think it is just so good.
SPEAKER_1: It builds the chaos until it's like full on absolutely chaotic.
SPEAKER_1: I crave it all the time.
SPEAKER_1: I think I tweeted the other day, it's like when you're playing one of the Jackbox games that's about like figuring out who the liar is.
SPEAKER_1: That's the tone of every game.
SPEAKER_1: It just slowly gets more and more chaotic.
SPEAKER_1: People start accusing each other and it's very good.
SPEAKER_1: I don't know how to solve this craving.
SPEAKER_2: Do we have to find the Mountain King?
SPEAKER_2: Where is his hall?
SPEAKER_2: How do we get more halls to the Mountain King?
SPEAKER_2: Who is the...
SPEAKER_2: What is the Mountain King?
SPEAKER_2: Is it just a king on the mountain?
SPEAKER_2: Where is he king of?
SPEAKER_2: What is his domain?
SPEAKER_1: Clearly, it's a chaotic mountain.
SPEAKER_1: Because my understanding of the Hall of the Mountain King...
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, as you get farther into the hall, it gets more and more chaotic.
SPEAKER_2: So how long is this hall, right?
SPEAKER_2: It takes what?
SPEAKER_1: Two and a half minutes to walk.
SPEAKER_2: That's a big hall.
SPEAKER_1: Maybe that is the...
SPEAKER_2: What are the things you see in the Hall of the Mountain King?
SPEAKER_2: As you walk down this hall, what are you seeing that is more and more chaotic?
SPEAKER_1: It starts out where you see some like...
SPEAKER_1: I think you just see some like normal things that you would expect in a hall, right?
SPEAKER_2: And you're kind of like, you're like, okay, I'm gonna see the Mountain King.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I'm gonna see the Mountain King.
SPEAKER_1: It's gonna be totally fine.
SPEAKER_1: And then you see a deer with three eyes, and you're like, it's a little weird.
SPEAKER_2: And then you see like a bunny balancing on like a ball, like a clown or a gesture, but it's a bunny.
SPEAKER_2: And it's a big ball, but it's a tiny bunny.
SPEAKER_2: And it's still like, it's not that chaotic, right?
SPEAKER_2: Because it's such a big ball, it's pretty easy.
SPEAKER_2: So it's like rolling back and forth pretty lazily, but it's like, okay, all right, all right.
SPEAKER_1: So we're seeing these bunnies and deer.
SPEAKER_2: So we got the bunnies and deer, we got the ball bunny and the three-eyed deer.
SPEAKER_2: Whatever is next.
SPEAKER_1: And then you see a really big animal.
SPEAKER_2: Is it like bigger than a bear?
SPEAKER_1: It's roughly the size of a bear, I would say.
SPEAKER_2: But it's like a cat.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's a cat the size of a bear.
SPEAKER_2: So is it like a lion on its hind leg?
SPEAKER_2: There's a lion who's balancing on its hind leg, and just walking like a person.
SPEAKER_1: There's just furries.
SPEAKER_2: So they're not furries.
SPEAKER_1: So they're a little bit unnerved because you're like, Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_1: Maybe there are people in fursuits.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe, but maybe they're just actually lions standing on their back legs.
SPEAKER_2: You don't know.
SPEAKER_2: That's kind of chaotic.
SPEAKER_1: That's a little bit chaotic.
SPEAKER_1: And you're kind of walking faster now.
SPEAKER_1: Because you're a little bit more worried about what you're seeing.
SPEAKER_2: Then they're just animals with knives.
SPEAKER_2: Lots of different knives.
SPEAKER_2: Some of them have swords.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, and they haven't noticed you yet.
SPEAKER_1: And that's worrying.
SPEAKER_1: And then Orpheus is there.
SPEAKER_2: And like, the wall is just dissolving behind you.
SPEAKER_2: And can you even see the end of this hall yet?
SPEAKER_2: It's kind of stretching in front of you.
SPEAKER_2: The drone is getting further and further.
SPEAKER_2: Even there is the Mountain King present.
SPEAKER_1: You see the door on the other side.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, cool.
SPEAKER_2: That's the end of the Hall of the Mountain King, because I guess after that is the Throne of the Mountain King.
SPEAKER_2: But there wasn't a sequel.
SPEAKER_2: Unfortunately, there was no sequel.
SPEAKER_1: So it's impossible to know, really.
SPEAKER_2: It's really impossible.
SPEAKER_2: Anyways, that's a weird hall.
SPEAKER_1: I think we can probably infer that he might be a furry.
SPEAKER_2: The Hall of...
SPEAKER_2: Okay, what is the Hall of the Mountain King?
SPEAKER_1: What?
SPEAKER_2: Is it like a mountain goat?
SPEAKER_2: This is where the mountain goats are.
SPEAKER_1: This is where both the animal, the mountain goats, and the band, the mountain goats comes from.
SPEAKER_2: The Mountain King is actually just the lead singer of The Hall of the Mountain Goats.
SPEAKER_2: The Hall of the Mountain Goats is...
SPEAKER_1: That's my new band, and that's a sick band name.
SPEAKER_2: Uh, yeah.
SPEAKER_1: That was fun.
SPEAKER_1: Thank you for that.
SPEAKER_2: Thanks for taking us down the hall.
SPEAKER_1: I'm going to say preemptively, good job on the editing on that one, Clair.
SPEAKER_2: Thanks, I did such a good job.
SPEAKER_1: It's time for you to give me your finale craving.
SPEAKER_2: Well, I guess since we've gotten through your addiction, and I guess I have time to share, I have also struggled with craving addiction because I often crave for the bad drivers to get good.
SPEAKER_2: I often crave for human drivers to get good, because you know, all human drivers are bad at driving, period, end of thing.
SPEAKER_1: I'm sorry, all human drivers?
SPEAKER_2: There are other bad drivers that are not human.
SPEAKER_2: But there are no good human drivers.
SPEAKER_2: There is no human driver that has ever driven good forever, including myself.
SPEAKER_2: I just crave whenever someone does a thing and it's like, wow, you shouldn't be driving.
SPEAKER_2: And I just think, you know what?
SPEAKER_2: No one should be driving.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, driving should not be a thing.
SPEAKER_2: Humans bad at moving, big thing.
SPEAKER_2: So how are we making sure that people drive good?
SPEAKER_1: This is going to sound like a weird segue, but stay with me here.
SPEAKER_1: The only reality show I've ever watched was Canada's Worst Driver.
SPEAKER_1: Which I watched many years ago when it was on.
SPEAKER_1: I don't think it's on anymore.
SPEAKER_1: But I loved that show.
SPEAKER_1: I had a great time watching it.
SPEAKER_1: Of course, I did not drive.
SPEAKER_2: How bad were they?
SPEAKER_2: I've never watched it.
SPEAKER_1: So the set up for Canada's Worst Driver is they bring together like all these bad drivers.
SPEAKER_2: An elite squad of bad drivers.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, usually like eight drivers and then like every episode, they eliminate a driver who's good.
SPEAKER_2: Oh damn, please GTFO.
SPEAKER_1: You want to get eliminated.
SPEAKER_1: Your goal is to get eliminated.
SPEAKER_1: That's so good.
SPEAKER_2: What a good concept.
SPEAKER_1: It's so good.
SPEAKER_1: They also did Canada's Worst Handyman after that, which is a similar thing.
SPEAKER_2: That sounds like a bigger disaster.
SPEAKER_2: Well, so I'm just going to fix the city's pattern.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, no, not quite that.
SPEAKER_2: There's a really important event coming up.
SPEAKER_1: It's more like around the house stuff.
SPEAKER_1: But Canada's Worst Driver, there was like a couple of moments, one in particular, I remember, where people actually improved at driving.
SPEAKER_2: Only a few moments?
SPEAKER_1: Well, people did improve at driving.
SPEAKER_1: That was the whole thing was like they would, they would kind of help people improve driving.
SPEAKER_1: But there was one person, I remember, he got like good at driving.
SPEAKER_1: The final thing that they do on Canada's Worst Driver every season is they take the top three worst drivers and they take them out to the streets of Montreal and have them drive.
SPEAKER_1: And that season, they kept this guy on, not because he was the worst of the worst, but because they felt like they could actually help him improve and like become a good driver.
SPEAKER_1: And he did.
SPEAKER_1: The last episode of the show is him just like having a final time driving in Montreal.
SPEAKER_1: Montreal, if we're going to teach people how to be better drivers, why not monetize it?
SPEAKER_2: Why?
SPEAKER_2: It's already been done.
SPEAKER_1: But this time we're going to do it as another reality show.
SPEAKER_2: What's the reality show?
SPEAKER_1: It's about as far as I got, so...
SPEAKER_2: What if it's an unreality show?
SPEAKER_1: What do you...
SPEAKER_1: I had another idea and I like the unreality.
SPEAKER_1: Let's explore that.
SPEAKER_1: But I was thinking, what about a driving anime?
SPEAKER_1: Just people how to drive.
SPEAKER_2: Oh my God.
SPEAKER_1: People like anime, right?
SPEAKER_2: People love anime.
SPEAKER_1: One of my friends was showing me Free, the swimming anime.
SPEAKER_2: I have watched Free with the same friend.
SPEAKER_1: What if it was a driving anime, and as it was showing you all the, I guess, hot boys probably, I think that the men in Free are supposed to be hot.
SPEAKER_1: So it's like showing you all these hot boys, but it's also teaching you how to drive.
SPEAKER_2: All right, cool.
SPEAKER_2: I like this.
SPEAKER_1: What's the unreality show?
SPEAKER_1: Anime is sort of unreality.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, it kind of is.
SPEAKER_2: So I think we've kind of reached the same destination.
SPEAKER_1: So it's the driving anime.
SPEAKER_2: It's the driving anime.
SPEAKER_2: And so like, I think it's a driving school anime, right?
SPEAKER_2: It's like, it has to be like the trope of like, I don't know, there's like a competition coming up and they're really bad, but they have to come together, like win this.
SPEAKER_2: It's like, all right, welcome to driving school 101.
SPEAKER_2: We're going to teach you how to do this stuff.
SPEAKER_2: But like most of the anime isn't cool car tricks.
SPEAKER_2: That's like 10% of the anime.
SPEAKER_2: 90% of the anime is genuinely learning about how to drive.
SPEAKER_1: How long do you think people will watch Hot Boys Take Notes?
SPEAKER_2: Pretty long.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, so it can be a lot of like the teachers teaching.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, the teacher is also probably a hot, well, no, you always have to have your like hot teacher in the anime.
SPEAKER_2: That's kind of the thing.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, so that's how it works.
SPEAKER_1: It's a lot of shots of the boys taking notes and like looking at each other.
SPEAKER_2: Making eye contact.
SPEAKER_1: Making eye contact and taking notes.
SPEAKER_2: Daydreaming about driving together.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_2: Going on drives together.
SPEAKER_1: Going on drives together where they repeat the things that they've learned.
SPEAKER_1: One of them yells like, Remember, put on your signal.
SPEAKER_1: Stuff like that.
SPEAKER_2: And it's like, Oh, you didn't signal.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, no, we're heading towards this thing.
SPEAKER_1: And it's like, it's like, This is plot relevant.
SPEAKER_1: There's lots of things where it's like, These unsafe driving practices have gotten these boys into a bad situation.
SPEAKER_1: You better not do these unsafe driving things.
SPEAKER_2: And then so like my favorite thing about going back to like sports, animes in general, there's usually like a trainer who's really good.
SPEAKER_2: What if it's not just a teacher?
SPEAKER_2: What if it's like a professional?
SPEAKER_2: Now, I don't want to say that NASCAR drivers are good because, like I said, all human drivers are bad.
SPEAKER_2: But among people who are confident in a car, if you're a human, you're a bad driver.
SPEAKER_2: I just want to make this clear.
SPEAKER_2: These drivers, these anime boys aren't going to be good drivers.
SPEAKER_2: They will be better drivers.
SPEAKER_1: No one can ever be a good driver.
SPEAKER_2: No human.
SPEAKER_2: I guess they're not human.
SPEAKER_2: They are anime.
SPEAKER_1: We can drive that point home by having them have like cat ears or something.
SPEAKER_2: Oh my God.
SPEAKER_1: Yes.
SPEAKER_1: Cat Boys.
SPEAKER_2: I'm actually invested in this now.
SPEAKER_1: Cat Boys driving school.
SPEAKER_2: Cat Boy Academy.
SPEAKER_1: Cat Boy Driving Academy.
SPEAKER_2: Cat Boys in Hot Cars.
SPEAKER_1: Cat Boys in Hot Cars.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, this is extremely good.
SPEAKER_1: There's got to be, know that my knowledge of anime comes from like two animes that I've seen, one of which is free, and in free, there's a character who's like an edgy, was once friends with the group, but isn't anymore.
SPEAKER_1: So like, is there a character like that here?
SPEAKER_1: Someone who goes to a rival driving school.
SPEAKER_2: It's the dog boy.
SPEAKER_1: The dog boy who goes to a rival driving school.
SPEAKER_2: And I think they make an exception, because the dog boy never wanted to be a dog, the dog boy wanted to be a cat boy.
SPEAKER_2: But they were teenage adolescents, there's whole drama there, and they explore that.
SPEAKER_2: But finally, the dog boy gets accepted in the Cat Boy Academy, Cat Boy in Hot Car Academy, and you know, maybe dog boy ears, cat boy tail, it's like that's the resolution, gets a cat boy tail.
SPEAKER_2: You suggested cat boys.
SPEAKER_1: You're right.
SPEAKER_1: And he's like a really good driver, and they have to learn to drive to like get to his level.
SPEAKER_2: The teacher, the NASCAR driver, teacher, cat boy, teacher adult, is like using this dog boy as like the perfect example.
SPEAKER_2: This is how you should drive.
SPEAKER_2: This is not a human.
SPEAKER_2: This is an anime.
SPEAKER_2: And actually says the words, this is an anime in like a gritty tone.
SPEAKER_2: This is, you are not people.
SPEAKER_2: You will drive well.
SPEAKER_1: This is an anime.
SPEAKER_2: Holy shit.
SPEAKER_2: The teacher does have like a gritty army voice where it's like, and we're gonna do some fucking pushups.
SPEAKER_2: This is an anime.
SPEAKER_1: How will that help with the driving?
SPEAKER_2: You're gonna need your arm strength and you gotta drive real good.
SPEAKER_1: And then of course the final competition is them driving around some sort of course as inspired by Canada's Worst Driver courses, which are excellent.
SPEAKER_2: And they're cats.
SPEAKER_2: Instead of cones, they have to drive around cats.
SPEAKER_1: No, because the thing that I'm saying is one of them has to fail at some point.
SPEAKER_2: That's the drama of it.
SPEAKER_2: And like almost gonna hit the cat and suddenly dog boy leaps in the way and saves the cat.
SPEAKER_2: It's like, you almost just killed the cat.
SPEAKER_2: And it's a whole thing.
SPEAKER_2: This is anime.
SPEAKER_2: It's dramatic or out.
SPEAKER_1: At the end of an episode, it's like you see the person make the mistake, they're going right for the cat and then the episode ends.
SPEAKER_1: And then it's the next episode and it's like he dives in.
SPEAKER_2: Come on, we don't have to do the Netflix thing of like what will happen?
SPEAKER_2: Just kidding.
SPEAKER_2: We'll resolve it in like the first five minutes.
SPEAKER_1: Yes, we do.
SPEAKER_2: Okay.
SPEAKER_2: All right.
SPEAKER_1: This is real TV.
SPEAKER_2: This is real TV.
SPEAKER_2: This is real anime.
SPEAKER_2: This is anime.
SPEAKER_1: We'll get Netflix to produce it.
SPEAKER_2: Thank you, Netflix, for funding.
SPEAKER_1: For funding Cat Boys in Hot Cars.
SPEAKER_2: Watch out for Cat Boys in Hot Cars Academy, a Netflix original coming 2022.
SPEAKER_1: They need a little bit.
SPEAKER_1: Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_1: Is it, is that hard to...
SPEAKER_1: Oh, um, I thought it was free.
SPEAKER_2: This is a therapy.
SPEAKER_2: I am a therapy.
SPEAKER_2: I am doing a therapy.
SPEAKER_2: I do not, I expect money.
SPEAKER_1: Is it not covered under my insurance?
SPEAKER_2: This is, you don't have insurance.
SPEAKER_2: This is a therapy.
SPEAKER_2: Insurance isn't covered by a therapy.
SPEAKER_1: You're right.
SPEAKER_1: It is super duper not.
SPEAKER_2: So will you be paying by Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram at Salt Cravings?
SPEAKER_1: Um, can I pay you at submissions at saltcravings.com by submitting a craving?
SPEAKER_2: We only take Patreon donations of one dollar.
SPEAKER_2: Or if you can't really pay, then I guess you could leave a review on iTunes or Stitcher, or I guess anywhere that accepts ratings.
SPEAKER_2: I suppose I'll accept.
SPEAKER_1: I guess I'll just, you know, I'll give a dollar on Patreon for this excellent service you've provided me.
SPEAKER_1: Thank you so much for seeing me.
SPEAKER_2: When are you coming back next?
SPEAKER_2: Do you still have addictions to cravings?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, you don't cure addiction like this.
SPEAKER_2: So what you're saying is I'll see you soon.