SPEAKER_1: Hello, everyone, and welcome to Salt Cravings 2.
SPEAKER_1: My name's Brianna.
SPEAKER_2: And my name's Clair, the sequel.
SPEAKER_1: Welcome to the sequel to Salt Cravings, Salt Cravings 2.
SPEAKER_1: I'm so excited that we get to announce Salt Cravings 2 today.
SPEAKER_1: It's a really exciting time.
SPEAKER_1: We've been working on this for a while and have been talking internally about Salt Cravings 2, the sequel to Salt Cravings.
SPEAKER_1: And here at Salt Cravings, incorporated as a corporation, we're really excited to share not only what Salt Cravings 2 is, but some of the new features.
SPEAKER_1: So obviously the first one, the most obvious one that you can hear is that my audio is back up to a good level and we are still recording remotely, but we both have really good mics.
SPEAKER_1: Let's run through what some of the features are of Salt Cravings 2, Clair.
SPEAKER_1: I know there's some you're really excited for.
SPEAKER_1: So do you wanna share those?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: So it did come to me this morning when I thought up and then immediately forgot a craving.
SPEAKER_2: It has to do with the one that I forgot.
SPEAKER_2: We'll see if it comes back to me, but I think Salt Cravings 2 is more political.
SPEAKER_1: Oh yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, it's so political now.
SPEAKER_1: So another feature of Salt Cravings 2 is we've removed the headphone jack.
SPEAKER_1: So now you're listening to this with a type C connector.
SPEAKER_1: So if you don't have that, that's a, you know, don't worry, we're selling you type C headphones.
SPEAKER_1: Don't worry about all that.
SPEAKER_2: Just get Bluetooth headphones.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_1: And trust me, sound quality is gonna be a whole lot better.
SPEAKER_1: You're gonna enjoy the podcast more.
SPEAKER_1: It's gonna be better in every conceivable way.
SPEAKER_2: So in Salt Cravings 2, now we each do 10 cravings, and these episodes are actually like 10 hours long.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: So I hope you're prepared.
SPEAKER_1: So we've decided to really increase the amount of hours of Salt Cravings content.
SPEAKER_1: We know that's what you guys wanted.
SPEAKER_1: And so yeah, we will be doing 10 cravings every episode.
SPEAKER_1: That's of course 10 each.
SPEAKER_2: And alternatively, we could maximize our cravings per second or CPS, and we could just rapid fire do a billion cravings in one episode and still keep it like an hour long.
SPEAKER_1: I think that that is also an option for sure.
SPEAKER_2: What is the quality of life that we're going for from an end user perspective?
SPEAKER_1: I think what we're going for is overwhelming.
SPEAKER_1: I think Salt Cravings is gonna be overwhelming.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, okay, overwhelming.
SPEAKER_1: I mean, when I think about like podcasts that I really enjoy listening to, I like the ones that overwhelm me with content that I can't fathom or understand.
SPEAKER_2: You just have to say a lot of words that are really myopic and a little egregious.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's sort of an erogenous kind of...
SPEAKER_1: Uh-huh, yeah, that was really it.
SPEAKER_3: That was the first one.
SPEAKER_2: That was the first word that came to your mind.
SPEAKER_1: In fairness, it sounded a lot like the words that you said.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, so that is Salt Cravings 2.
SPEAKER_1: Shall we do the first craving of this 20 Craving pod?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, that sounds good.
SPEAKER_2: Gotta get it out of the way.
SPEAKER_2: We can't drag it on, you know.
SPEAKER_2: It would really suck if, for the user, if we just kept going on about the intro and sort of just lingered here for a while, never really moving on or anything.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, you really don't want to linger on the intro.
SPEAKER_1: Let's talk about that for a sec.
SPEAKER_2: How was your day, Brianna?
SPEAKER_1: Did a little bit of cleaning, you know, all that.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, nice, nice.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, yeah, how was your day?
SPEAKER_2: Oh, you know, not bad.
SPEAKER_2: Got off work.
SPEAKER_2: I also did a little bit of cleaning.
SPEAKER_2: You know, my roommate actually beat me to one of my tasks, and then now I'm here.
SPEAKER_2: Wow, well, we should get rid of roommates.
SPEAKER_2: It's a mandated order.
SPEAKER_2: If they're beating us.
SPEAKER_2: We can't lose at keeping a clean house.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that's, if you do that, then you get canceled on Twitter.
SPEAKER_2: Dirty house privilege.
SPEAKER_2: That's-
SPEAKER_1: Dirty house privilege.
SPEAKER_2: So my first craving, if I could move us along though.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, yeah, no, I think we've really done a good job of not lingering on the intro, so please give me your first craving.
SPEAKER_2: Great, great, cool, cool, cool.
SPEAKER_1: Just give me the first craving, Clair.
SPEAKER_1: Just go for it.
SPEAKER_2: We have been doing a lot of video calls.
SPEAKER_2: You and me, especially, have been doing a lot of video calls.
SPEAKER_2: But I feel like when I say we have been doing a lot of video calls, I mean, probably everybody listening to this, it's kind of bad.
SPEAKER_2: And there was a tweet recently by one of our mutual friends, Talteria on Twitter, not sure about using real names, et cetera, but Talteria on Twitter mentioned some really good points about video calling that I just have not been able to stop thinking about.
SPEAKER_2: One of the problems is you can't have multiple conversations at once.
SPEAKER_1: No.
SPEAKER_2: It's just it's not feasible to have multiple conversations.
SPEAKER_2: This is sort of leading in to my craving.
SPEAKER_2: It's not exactly related, but...
SPEAKER_1: I'm going to say we kind of did already solve video calling in a previous episode.
SPEAKER_2: I've just been thinking about it a lot more.
SPEAKER_2: So I guess I'm still just lingering.
SPEAKER_2: And I have a proof of concept that maybe I'll show you after this video call.
SPEAKER_2: But I'm going to keep this in so that if you want to know my proof of concept, tweet at me, ClaireSkiesAhead, and I will DM you.
SPEAKER_2: But that's just a little, you know, do you have a craving to know?
SPEAKER_2: Tell me about it.
SPEAKER_3: So my actual craving...
SPEAKER_1: That should be our outro, engineer.
SPEAKER_2: My actual craving is I've been craving the return of IRC chats.
SPEAKER_1: Hell yeah.
SPEAKER_2: IRC chats, if you're not familiar, I need to look up what the acronym actually means.
SPEAKER_2: It's an Internet Relay Chat.
SPEAKER_2: But basically what it means is like it's what most of us know as just a chat room now.
SPEAKER_2: Like when you think of like it's a bunch of people in a chat room talking to each other.
SPEAKER_2: And I've become interested in this recently because I've been joining instances of a PsyTube, CYTube, which you can just cue music together and listen to music together and then talk.
SPEAKER_2: And there's no like you can't share video or anything.
SPEAKER_2: So it's not like Discord thing.
SPEAKER_2: And I think how that changes communication is like when it comes to video calling, the emphasis is on paying attention.
SPEAKER_2: If you leave, you sort of have to say that you're leaving.
SPEAKER_2: But on an IRC chat, if you're really engaged, the most you have to do is type BRB and like, that's it.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that's a really good point.
SPEAKER_1: I was never super involved in chat rooms.
SPEAKER_1: That was never really my forte.
SPEAKER_1: But I think they're really interesting.
SPEAKER_1: The thing that I think stopped me from being involved in chat rooms is the latent fear that is in me of being afraid of strangers on the internet.
SPEAKER_2: I've actually been doing a lot more just posting online and talking to strangers on the internet since this all began.
SPEAKER_1: I'm very brave of you.
SPEAKER_1: Well, I used to be...
SPEAKER_2: Here's the thing.
SPEAKER_2: As a child, I did it a lot.
SPEAKER_2: As a young teenager, older youth, I would go on to chat rooms or video games and just talk to strangers.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, from nowadays, from a privacy perspective, it would be probably terrifying to reflect on that.
SPEAKER_2: Now it's like, well, I'm an adult.
SPEAKER_2: The worst they can do is probably find my email and I guess send me mail.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: They could dox me, I guess.
SPEAKER_1: They could.
SPEAKER_1: They could yell at you a lot and dox you.
SPEAKER_2: But the thing is, the internet now is a lot more public.
SPEAKER_2: When Facebook made the move of no longer letting you use fake names, the risk of doxing increased.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: So any attempt at anonymity is better than that.
SPEAKER_2: So really being anonymous makes it fun because I no longer have fear of like, oh, what if someone thinks what I said is ridiculous?
SPEAKER_2: Who cares, right?
SPEAKER_2: It's going to disappear in five seconds when the rest of the chat scrolls up.
SPEAKER_1: That's really interesting.
SPEAKER_1: The way that I think I did end up talking to strangers a bit in kind of high school would have been through Tumblr, because Tumblr was the way that I first kind of began to come to terms with my gender and stuff.
SPEAKER_1: And so I have a couple of trans girlfriends and honestly also cis girlfriends who I know from the Tumblr days.
SPEAKER_1: And I don't know why that one felt a little bit safer to me.
SPEAKER_1: I don't know why Tumblr felt safe to me.
SPEAKER_1: I probably shouldn't have.
SPEAKER_2: But I've seen some shit on Tumblr.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I mean, I have too, and I had two then.
SPEAKER_1: But it was like I definitely made friends with people, which was always wild to me.
SPEAKER_1: I was like, Oh, I can't go into a chat room or a forum or whatever, because there are people there.
SPEAKER_1: They kind of, you know, I feel like it was like, there aren't real people on Tumblr.
SPEAKER_2: There's just bots.
SPEAKER_2: Right?
SPEAKER_1: Well, it was more like it was more along the lines of like me kind of looking at chat rooms and forums and stuff and being like, Oh, people already know each other on there.
SPEAKER_1: If I come in there, I'm going to be a weirdo new person.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_1: There's no people versus like that's kind of exciting.
SPEAKER_1: Friends online is no, it's terrifying.
SPEAKER_1: It's terrifying.
SPEAKER_2: But there's so much history.
SPEAKER_2: There's like inside jokes that like you get to learn about.
SPEAKER_1: How do you know that there's just not gonna hate you immediately and completely because don't be an asshole.
SPEAKER_2: And most people don't.
SPEAKER_1: I'll have you know that a lot of people are very mean online.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: And this is the thing about most modern chats, at least the ones that I'm in.
SPEAKER_2: One of the rules is like, hey, don't be a dick.
SPEAKER_2: So if you are a dick, you get kicked.
SPEAKER_2: So I mean, if you're not the one being a dick, then you're pretty safe from the ass hats and the meanies.
SPEAKER_1: But what if you are accidentally a dick?
SPEAKER_1: What if you accidentally say something that is against what people do in that chat room, and all of them start yelling at you and then you have to cry?
SPEAKER_1: And I have some good news again.
SPEAKER_2: You can't technically yell on the internet.
SPEAKER_2: Through an IRC chat, the worst you can get is full caps.
SPEAKER_2: No one's going to yell at you.
SPEAKER_2: You're just going to like have some words come on the screen.
SPEAKER_1: Clair, I'll have you know, words can hurt a lot.
SPEAKER_1: Words can hurt a lot.
SPEAKER_2: I absolutely feel that.
SPEAKER_1: So therefore, all IRC chat bad?
SPEAKER_1: I don't know.
SPEAKER_1: I did no issue with IRC chats.
SPEAKER_1: I just personally always felt like I always get super different anxious about like new spaces.
SPEAKER_2: I'm going to send you a YouTube video livestream, a 24-7 Nintendo Music Livestream that I have been sort of hanging out in for the past couple days now.
SPEAKER_2: And you should come, you should listen to it.
SPEAKER_2: Because, and this is why it sort of made me think of IRC chats, it is 24-7 and also the music is hand curated.
SPEAKER_2: So you can request songs if you have like a sponsorship or whatnot, but there's usually mods in there and there's pretty much always people requesting songs.
SPEAKER_2: And like the other day even, people teamed up to make sure that they were playing every generation of Pokemon songs because you can only request a song an hour.
SPEAKER_2: So a bunch of people were like, okay, I'm going to do Gen 1.
SPEAKER_2: All right, you do Gen 2.
SPEAKER_2: All right, I'll do Gen 3.
SPEAKER_2: And I've just been going there and sort of hanging out.
SPEAKER_2: And now it's my third day there.
SPEAKER_2: And there's like one or two people that I've just begun talking to.
SPEAKER_2: I don't know who they are.
SPEAKER_2: They don't know who I am.
SPEAKER_2: I use a pseudonym and I'm sure so do they.
SPEAKER_2: And it's just like random people talking to each other.
SPEAKER_2: And I'm like, that's sick as hell.
SPEAKER_2: Like who knows who these people are, right?
SPEAKER_1: That sounds super duper rad.
SPEAKER_1: Now, Clair, in terms of solving this craving, how would you create the perfect IRC chat where people who are nervous little babies like me would feel kind of as comfortable as possible?
SPEAKER_1: And also it's just the perfect IRC chat always.
SPEAKER_1: It's just the perfect one.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe you, the baby, needs to tell me, the adult, what you need coming into an IRC chat.
SPEAKER_3: Because it seems like...
SPEAKER_1: Goo goo ga ga.
SPEAKER_2: So there are professional diaper changers on site in this IRC chat.
SPEAKER_2: Now, if you do lie down...
SPEAKER_1: Okay, that's enough of that.
SPEAKER_1: I feel like it is mostly just that like, I never know how to meet people, unless I'm meeting them by going up on a stage or being at a camp with them.
SPEAKER_1: These are how I've made most of my friends, are like very dramatic Brianna ways, and very little of it is going into an established group and being like, hi, I'm Brianna.
SPEAKER_2: I feel like most of the ways that I've met my friends has been like online apps or being invited to hang out to a larger group by someone at a party.
SPEAKER_2: And that sort of just cascades, right?
SPEAKER_2: Like, I mean, I met you at a party, which I got invited to by a different person who I'm pretty sure I met at a party.
SPEAKER_2: And so then there were more people, you know?
SPEAKER_2: That's just sort of how it went.
SPEAKER_2: But back in my teenage days, I had a lot of online friends, and now I just don't.
SPEAKER_2: Well, okay, that's not true.
SPEAKER_2: I have people who I once knew in real life, and then they moved away.
SPEAKER_2: But I don't have people who it's like, oh, we've never hung out in real life, and we can't hang out in real life.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, fair.
SPEAKER_1: It might be something about text.
SPEAKER_1: It might be just the fact that like, I'm a lot more confident kind of putting yourself out there like in physical form and in physical space than I am through text, because I'm a very performative person, and it's a lot harder to be performative over text.
SPEAKER_2: I do feel that.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, you know, we're both very performative people in that sense, maybe in different ways in certain aspects.
SPEAKER_2: But I use a lot of like emojis.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe I shouldn't say emojis.
SPEAKER_2: I use emoticons, which are different because they're not emojis.
SPEAKER_2: Because I hate, well, I hate specifically the YouTube emojis, and I hate most emojis.
SPEAKER_2: And emoticons, which are just like, well, my favorite one is like C colon, which is just a happy face, but it's not like every single normal happy face emoji looks like it wants to murder you, you know?
SPEAKER_2: Like, why do they want to look like they're just like dead inside?
SPEAKER_2: Like, I've lost my soul, and you're the next victim on my list is sort of how I feel with every single just neutral smiling emoji.
SPEAKER_1: I feel like I need to like have signature emojis.
SPEAKER_2: Just steal them from others.
SPEAKER_2: That's what I did.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, probably.
SPEAKER_1: I recently figured out what my signature heart is, so that's something.
SPEAKER_2: What's your signature heart?
SPEAKER_1: It's the like pink one with like multiple hearts.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, nice, nice, nice.
SPEAKER_2: I have meanings to all my hearts.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, what are the meanings to all of your hearts?
SPEAKER_1: That is a secret.
SPEAKER_2: That's never going to be divulged.
SPEAKER_2: That is my own personal code.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: Girl can keep secrets.
SPEAKER_1: Do you have any other signature emojis?
SPEAKER_1: Or sorry, emoticons?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, so colon, apostrophe, right bracket, where it's like happy crying face.
SPEAKER_1: It's a good one.
SPEAKER_2: Just like a single tear rolling down your cheek, right?
SPEAKER_2: It's like, this is great, but also I'm sad sort of response, which is I feel is applicable to most things right now.
SPEAKER_1: That's a mood.
SPEAKER_1: We are all both sad and happy.
SPEAKER_1: We have the capacity to be both.
SPEAKER_2: Schrodinger's emotions.
SPEAKER_1: Schrodinger's emoticon.
SPEAKER_1: What's the Schrodinger's emoticon?
SPEAKER_1: Is it just a box and a cat?
SPEAKER_1: It's a cat.
SPEAKER_1: What would be some other just general things that you would have in your Perfect IRC chat?
SPEAKER_1: Disregard what the little baby needs.
SPEAKER_1: Tell me the ideal for you.
SPEAKER_2: A fun one is jump in, jump out games.
SPEAKER_2: And when I say jump in, jump out, I think there's a better term for it.
SPEAKER_2: But did you ever play or see or look up videos of the Kirby video game for the Switch?
SPEAKER_1: That's the friend one, right?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, the friend one.
SPEAKER_2: I think it's like All Star.
SPEAKER_2: No, it's All Friends.
SPEAKER_2: It has friends in the title, I think.
SPEAKER_1: It definitely has friends in the title.
SPEAKER_2: It's Kirby All Star Smash Mouth.
SPEAKER_1: Friendship.
SPEAKER_2: But yeah, you can literally in the middle of a level in that game just have somebody join the game.
SPEAKER_1: It's Kirby Star Allies, by the way.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: It's not friends in the title.
SPEAKER_2: Allies at the table.
SPEAKER_2: You could just jump in and out of that game at any point if you weren't player one.
SPEAKER_2: And I think that should be a thing for IRC chats, right?
SPEAKER_1: So there has to be a player one.
SPEAKER_1: Right, the mod is player one.
SPEAKER_2: The chat mod, you're the player mod.
SPEAKER_2: You're the player one.
SPEAKER_2: You're the player mod.
SPEAKER_1: You're the player mod.
SPEAKER_2: God, what are some like jump in, jump out games?
SPEAKER_2: Scrabble.
SPEAKER_2: What's Scrabble?
SPEAKER_1: I guess a lot of like text chat games are kind of that.
SPEAKER_1: You know that game where you all try to say increasing numbers without repeating them?
SPEAKER_1: So like one person says one, another person says two, another person says three, another person says four, and another person says five at the same time someone else says five, and you have to start all over again.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, right.
SPEAKER_2: OK, OK, cool.
SPEAKER_2: I thought you meant like not concurrent numbers.
SPEAKER_2: So I was like, well, why wouldn't I just say like after after you say one, I say ten because probably no one's going to say.
SPEAKER_1: No, no, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_1: You got to say them in order.
SPEAKER_2: OK, I thought this was like a game of like, oh, I don't know a number that comes after that number.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, no, we've gone too high, which is like an alternate one.
SPEAKER_3: But I think a text based game wouldn't work very well.
SPEAKER_1: It's a similar one to that Discord meme from a while ago where you tried to say different lyrics one after another of a song and then people would edit together a video with the song playing over.
SPEAKER_1: Did you see this at all?
SPEAKER_2: No.
SPEAKER_1: I'll send you an example after and I'll link one in the description, but it was very good and funny to see people try to do lyric after lyric and then someone fucked it up and it was wild.
SPEAKER_1: But there are good text games where it's like, okay, you can like play and then you can like hop out and let everyone else play and then you can keep playing if you want.
SPEAKER_2: What about like to choose your own adventure, but like the chat is the party.
SPEAKER_2: You know Twitch plays Pokemon and then I don't know, it turned into Twitch.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, except Twitch plays IRC.
SPEAKER_1: Twitch plays IRC.
SPEAKER_1: I'm sure that someone has done that.
SPEAKER_2: See Twitch plays Pokemon was like a voting system, which gets boring really quickly because it always feels like most voting systems very discouraging because the more people there are, the less impact it feels like you have.
SPEAKER_2: So what if there was like you're automatically assorted into like a team?
SPEAKER_1: Oh, that's interesting.
SPEAKER_2: What if there are teams and like if you drop in and drop out, like that's okay because the size of the team doesn't really matter.
SPEAKER_2: Like there's maybe a maximum team size, like maybe it's like three people, but like you can just have an unlimited amount of teams.
SPEAKER_1: That feels like it gets really unbalanced really quickly.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, we could make it balanced.
SPEAKER_2: We'll make the perfect game.
SPEAKER_2: We'll make the perfect IRC drop in drop out game with three people teams, one to three people.
SPEAKER_2: Actually, you know what?
SPEAKER_2: I found the perfect solution.
SPEAKER_2: Who your teammates are doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_2: I was thinking instead of having one person on your own, the minimum team size is two.
SPEAKER_2: And if someone joins, the teams just immediately get shuffled.
SPEAKER_2: So like your teammates don't matter.
SPEAKER_2: You just help your team and your team is always, you get points based on like what your current team gets.
SPEAKER_2: And then you can spend those points on like unlocking emoticons maybe or emojis or song requests.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, I love chaos.
SPEAKER_1: Great and good.
SPEAKER_1: I feel like a lot of people would fuck with the system.
SPEAKER_2: That's totally fine.
SPEAKER_2: It's meant to be fucked with.
SPEAKER_2: Who brings order to a chat?
SPEAKER_1: That's a cool idea.
SPEAKER_1: What is the game itself?
SPEAKER_2: Lovers to Rivals.
SPEAKER_1: What is that?
SPEAKER_2: It's a game I've just made up.
SPEAKER_2: It's called Lovers to Rivals.
SPEAKER_1: Yep.
SPEAKER_1: And how does it work?
SPEAKER_2: When you jump in, you are a lover.
SPEAKER_2: And as you progress through the game, you are a rival.
SPEAKER_2: Like your goal is to become a rival.
SPEAKER_2: If you successfully become a rival, then you drop out.
SPEAKER_2: Like you're that sort of...
SPEAKER_2: And like this is asynchronous.
SPEAKER_2: Like people can like work towards becoming a rival at different points.
SPEAKER_2: Like you could jump in 20 minutes after me, and that's totally fine.
SPEAKER_2: Maybe it's just button smashing, trying to say woo woo the most so that you make people hate you, so that you're no longer lovers and that you're instead just rivals.
SPEAKER_1: It's an anti-community building game.
SPEAKER_1: It's a community destroying game.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, it's like Downfall, the IRC chat.
SPEAKER_1: Oh my god, the concept of a game of Downfall, which by the way is a tabletop game where you tell the story of a society falling apart.
SPEAKER_1: The idea of that, of a game of that that takes place in an IRC chat brings me with such delight.
SPEAKER_1: It's just fully like, that means it's about an IRC chat falling apart.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, so good.
SPEAKER_2: And then the whole time there's music, right?
SPEAKER_2: I think the best part about the music stream I sent to, and which I'm assuming is going to be linked in the description, you basically just have like a DJ going, except the DJ is everybody requesting songs together.
SPEAKER_2: It's like collaborative DJing, which is maybe just as a craving on its own, but I feel like we've spent a while on this craving.
SPEAKER_1: I think it's been a good while.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, I think it's been a good while too.
SPEAKER_2: Anyways, bring back IRC chats, talk to strangers on the internet, use a pseudonym, you know, don't give your information out, and don't be a dick, and also find chats that have mods that, you know, are gonna listen.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, and find good chats with good mods and good rules.
SPEAKER_2: And if you like Nintendo music, I've found one for you.
SPEAKER_2: It's in the link below.
SPEAKER_2: Like, comment, and subscribe.
SPEAKER_2: Now give me your craving.
SPEAKER_1: So, my cravings this week have some, let's say they are cravings with ethical implications.
SPEAKER_2: Ooh, I love ethical implications.
SPEAKER_1: My first one is directly about my...
SPEAKER_3: So, today you've been craving eugenics.
SPEAKER_1: So, today what I have been craving is a way to ethically order things online.
SPEAKER_1: Because I don't know if you're aware, but you can't buy things right now.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's so hard.
SPEAKER_1: And if you try to, you have to do it online.
SPEAKER_1: And online, I never feel good about ordering from, right?
SPEAKER_1: Like, I have done it.
SPEAKER_1: I have ordered things that I have needed, but I never feel good about it.
SPEAKER_2: Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_1: Yep.
SPEAKER_1: That is because, especially right now, doing the job of delivering the things that you're ordering is fucking awful and terrifying and all of that.
SPEAKER_1: And, you know, as a father, as a person with a father who is a postal worker, it's a real tough thing for me to be like, yeah, I need to order things in, but also I hear about the conditions that my dad is in and they are not great.
SPEAKER_2: I don't know.
SPEAKER_2: I don't have like firsthand info, actually.
SPEAKER_2: Do you want to share maybe a little bit?
SPEAKER_2: That might be like good.
SPEAKER_1: I don't want to say what post company he works for because I don't want to get him in trouble.
SPEAKER_2: No, of course not.
SPEAKER_1: But I will say that from what he's told me, there's very little like personal protective equipment.
SPEAKER_1: You basically have one pair of gloves for a day.
SPEAKER_2: That's pointless.
SPEAKER_2: You might as well just be using your hands.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, and you're like washing at the stations where you're sorting the mail, but that's it.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_1: It's really not good out there, and it's also bad for just like all package delivery things and such.
SPEAKER_1: It's a rough time out here where I'm like, hmm, there are things that I need and also things that I want, and I can't go out and get them, so my only option is to put other people in danger.
SPEAKER_1: So, Clair, can we just fix this?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, yeah, sure.
SPEAKER_1: Can we just create ethical consumption under capitalism?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, let's create some...
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, uh-huh.
SPEAKER_1: You said you love ethical implications, so here you go.
SPEAKER_2: Did I say that?
SPEAKER_1: You did say that.
SPEAKER_1: Roll the clip.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, I did.
SPEAKER_1: Roll the...
SPEAKER_2: Ah, there it is.
SPEAKER_2: I definitely didn't...
SPEAKER_2: I didn't insert it again, but I'm gonna just take your word on this.
SPEAKER_2: So, consider this.
SPEAKER_2: You just give them more gloves.
SPEAKER_2: So, that's a start.
SPEAKER_2: Next, are we creating ethical consumption under capitalism, or are we just making safer work conditions for postal delivery, folks?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, here's the thing is, I don't know if there is a way to create fully safe working conditions in this current climate for postal workers, so I think we just need to find a way to fix it.
SPEAKER_1: What if...
SPEAKER_1: Okay, actually, no, I figured it out.
SPEAKER_1: So, I'm actually gonna fix this unethical thing with another unethical thing, which is the Iron Man suit.
SPEAKER_1: Which is, as we all know, Tony Stark, very bad.
SPEAKER_1: Iron Man suit, unethical.
SPEAKER_3: What, but they made like three movies on him.
SPEAKER_2: There's no way he could be bad.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, yeah, you're right.
SPEAKER_1: Sorry.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, no, I totally cried when he died, for sure.
SPEAKER_1: And, but if everyone has an Iron Man suit, and you know what, let's expand this past just postal workers.
SPEAKER_1: Let's also expand this into like cashiers and other people who are being made to go to work.
SPEAKER_2: And how let's just give everyone an Iron Man suit.
SPEAKER_2: Why not?
SPEAKER_1: Let's just give everyone an Iron Man suit.
SPEAKER_1: They wake up.
SPEAKER_2: This is your like outside suit.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's your outside suit.
SPEAKER_1: It's just you have it just outside your door.
SPEAKER_3: This is just like, this is just a hamster wheel, but it fits your body.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, and it has to, and that's a significant improvement because it has to fit your body because you have to deliver the mail or do the groceries or whatever.
SPEAKER_1: So I think it's a huge improvement.
SPEAKER_2: Okay.
SPEAKER_2: What if I'm considering we could just pause because there's going to be clapping now.
SPEAKER_2: Can you hear that?
SPEAKER_1: Oh, we should just wait.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, I'm going to go get my laundry then.
SPEAKER_1: I just want everyone to know that we had to pause talking about how there is no protection for workers and there's no, like, ethical working in this crisis so that the people could clap at the health care workers.
SPEAKER_1: And this is important for me to say, even if this isn't kept in, this might just be for Clair if Clair listens to this.
SPEAKER_1: I just needed everyone to know that because I think it's wild and super ironic.
SPEAKER_1: Anyway, clapping's nice and good, but actually we should have protections in place for people rather than just kind of meaninglessly treating them like heroes.
SPEAKER_1: And that's what I have to say about that.
SPEAKER_1: Real shit moments.
SPEAKER_1: All right, now we can go back to the goose.
SPEAKER_2: And I'm back.
SPEAKER_1: Welcome back.
SPEAKER_1: You are very pixely.
SPEAKER_1: You're full pixels.
SPEAKER_1: You are fully pixels for a second.
SPEAKER_2: Where were we?
SPEAKER_1: Before we paused for that, we were talking about Iron Man suits for workers.
SPEAKER_2: Right.
SPEAKER_2: I forget what I was saying, but Iron Man suits are bad.
SPEAKER_2: Here's maybe a different idea.
SPEAKER_2: Not that, first off.
SPEAKER_1: I don't see that there's any ethical problems with giving every person an Iron Man suit.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, now when we say an Iron Man suit, can it shoot missiles?
SPEAKER_1: I guess.
SPEAKER_2: That's a problem right there.
SPEAKER_1: I mean, I suppose if you want to, we could limit the ability to shoot missiles to just those who work customer service.
SPEAKER_2: Sorry, the customer service doesn't get it.
SPEAKER_2: Their managers get it, you know, in case they want to quit.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, God.
SPEAKER_2: This is, you know, fixing capitalism.
SPEAKER_1: I believe we've now entered the realm of the cyberpunk.
SPEAKER_2: The cyberpunk capitalism.
SPEAKER_1: If you hate Iron Man suits so much, and I don't understand why you have any ethical problems with everyone having a weapon on their body, you suggest a different solution.
SPEAKER_2: Do you remember in like gym class, there was those little like scooters that like, God, they weren't even scooters.
SPEAKER_2: They were just like, there must be a name for it.
SPEAKER_1: The like things that slid on the ground?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: And it's just like a flat dolly, but it's tiny and you just sit on it.
SPEAKER_2: And it's tiny.
SPEAKER_2: I want to like emphasize.
SPEAKER_2: Like maybe you could crisscross your legs on it.
SPEAKER_2: But what we need...
SPEAKER_1: And is this you, a child?
SPEAKER_2: We implement those.
SPEAKER_2: And then on top of that, do you know the technology where like toilets have like the plastic on it that like changes between uses?
SPEAKER_1: Yes.
SPEAKER_2: Now imagine one of those dollies.
SPEAKER_2: I'm going to call them a dolly.
SPEAKER_2: There's probably a word for it with plastic wrap on it that could change every time.
SPEAKER_2: And then you put like a package on it, or you put like a food on it, and then you push it and it goes to the other person, and they pick the thing up, and then the plastic changes, it goes back.
SPEAKER_1: So here's a couple of questions that I have.
SPEAKER_1: And now I want to, they're not criticisms, but they are questions.
SPEAKER_2: We don't have criticisms on this show.
SPEAKER_1: No, I don't like to critique.
SPEAKER_1: I think it like pretty aggressive.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I think it's pretty aggressive.
SPEAKER_1: Critique is aggressive.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I don't want to critique.
SPEAKER_1: I don't want to be critical, but I just do want to ask some questions.
SPEAKER_1: What the fuck?
SPEAKER_1: Because my major questions are, what if the person is not home?
SPEAKER_1: That's A.
SPEAKER_1: And then B is, so does this mean everyone has to carry around a bunch of plastic wrap?
SPEAKER_1: Because we'll get to that if that is the case, because I have some concerns about that.
SPEAKER_1: No, not concerns, questions.
SPEAKER_1: Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_2: So no, I don't think you have to carry around plastic wrap.
SPEAKER_2: I think it's like built in, right?
SPEAKER_2: Imagine like a roll of plastic wrap that automatically moved.
SPEAKER_1: So I do still have a question about this.
SPEAKER_1: But can we address first the what if you aren't home thing?
SPEAKER_2: I mean, it's so small, right?
SPEAKER_2: It could just slip under your door.
SPEAKER_1: What about the package?
SPEAKER_3: Hmm, like what if it just needs to put it on your front door, right?
SPEAKER_1: And it can go upstairs?
SPEAKER_2: Sure, why not?
SPEAKER_2: It can grow legs, little robot legs.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, it's a robot.
SPEAKER_1: Good.
SPEAKER_3: Well, it's clearly a robot because it could move.
SPEAKER_2: Well, I guess it didn't have to be a robot.
SPEAKER_2: What if it just has normal legs?
SPEAKER_2: What if it has not robot legs?
SPEAKER_3: What if you put like doll legs on it?
SPEAKER_2: A dolly with doll legs.
SPEAKER_1: And then those doll legs...
SPEAKER_1: A true doll?
SPEAKER_1: That's a true dolly.
SPEAKER_2: What if you had like a fan of legs?
SPEAKER_2: And by that, I mean like you had like six legs, sort of windmill blades, and then that's what propelled this thing.
SPEAKER_2: And so instead of wheels, you have legs.
SPEAKER_2: And so because you have like six legs, you can climb things.
SPEAKER_2: This is science.
SPEAKER_1: I mean, I guess it works.
SPEAKER_1: So can we just, I just want to address like another just question that I had, which is this uses a lot of plastic, and that's a problem.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, right now we got to use plastic because we don't have compostable plastic or compostable single-use items.
SPEAKER_1: Fair.
SPEAKER_2: Like sterile compostable single-use items.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, I know, for sure.
SPEAKER_2: Well, maybe the solution is a sterile compostable single-use item.
SPEAKER_2: So we'll just make that.
SPEAKER_2: So we're gonna start with compostable single-use straws because apparently that is where we need to start, according to the government.
SPEAKER_1: Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_1: That's the most important thing.
SPEAKER_2: So that's where we're gonna start during these times, and everything else can wait.
SPEAKER_1: No, for sure.
SPEAKER_2: What are we gonna make it out of?
SPEAKER_2: Brianna, what's the solution that scientists have been struggling with for now many decades?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, so we really wanted to be compostable and renewable.
SPEAKER_1: Now, I think people have used the trees for a lot of things, and I don't want to put any more strain on trees.
SPEAKER_1: I'm thinking the thing that trees grow in.
SPEAKER_1: Dirt.
SPEAKER_2: Dirt straws?
SPEAKER_2: So we don't even need to compost this?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: It is the compost.
SPEAKER_1: A dirt box.
SPEAKER_2: It's called the dirt box.
SPEAKER_2: Alright, explain how the dirt box works.
SPEAKER_1: So if you compress dirt, it becomes solid.
SPEAKER_2: Dirt is solid.
SPEAKER_1: Right, but it becomes super solid.
SPEAKER_1: And it can be used as a box if you just compress it enough.
SPEAKER_1: You have to put it through a compressive machine.
SPEAKER_2: When you say a box, do you mean like a box in which you can put something in or just a solid cube?
SPEAKER_1: I mean a box you can put something in.
SPEAKER_1: We could already do the whole cube thing like Minecraft already showed us we can do that.
SPEAKER_1: So I'm really thinking past Minecraft here, and I'm thinking like just a box you can put things in.
SPEAKER_1: It's made of dirt.
SPEAKER_1: So that's the dirt box.
SPEAKER_2: It's a real good ethical solution is dirt.
SPEAKER_2: I don't know why I didn't think of that.
SPEAKER_2: I don't know why no one's ever thought of that.
SPEAKER_2: Yes, it's just, you know, there's so much dirt.
SPEAKER_2: It's not like we're going to run out of dirt, right?
SPEAKER_1: Quote from Planet that's run out of dirt.
SPEAKER_1: What are we going to do?
SPEAKER_2: Run out of the year is 2040.
SPEAKER_2: There's no more dirt.
SPEAKER_3: Wow, I really thought we weren't going to run out of dirt.
SPEAKER_2: There's this like quote in this textbook from this weird offhand podcast in the year 2020.
SPEAKER_2: There's no way we can run out of dirt.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, no, it doesn't happen like that.
SPEAKER_1: You can't just run out of dirt.
SPEAKER_3: Things work like what are you going to do?
SPEAKER_2: Where are you going to put it?
SPEAKER_2: You got your dirt and then you use it and you put it back in the dirt and you're done.
SPEAKER_2: You've got more dirt.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that's how it works.
SPEAKER_1: It's renewable.
SPEAKER_2: If you put something in the dirt box, does it also compost because it is in the dirt box?
SPEAKER_1: Not immediately, no.
SPEAKER_1: But I mean, over time, I guess if it's compostable, it's just a box, Clair.
SPEAKER_2: What's the lifespan of this box?
SPEAKER_2: From dirt to dirt, as they say.
SPEAKER_1: It's actually, I was just asked to dust to dust, but sure.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, that was the joke.
SPEAKER_1: It's fine.
SPEAKER_1: I'm tired.
SPEAKER_1: It lasts a pretty long time.
SPEAKER_1: It lasts five.
SPEAKER_2: You can't do the same joke every day.
SPEAKER_2: Five what, Brianna?
SPEAKER_1: Hours?
SPEAKER_2: Give me a unit.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, wow.
SPEAKER_2: I really thought you were just going to say like five horses or something.
SPEAKER_1: No, no, five hours.
SPEAKER_1: I just I felt like I was kind of embarrassed because the scientists told me originally that they could make it last for like five weeks.
SPEAKER_1: But then I looked at the data and I looked at the papers that I have in front of me, and it actually only lasts for five hours.
SPEAKER_2: So I love that the scientists told you five weeks, and then you discerned that they were actually wrong.
SPEAKER_2: It's five hours.
SPEAKER_1: Well, no, they said that originally at the start of the project when we first conceived of the dirt box.
SPEAKER_1: And then they sent me the dirt box stats, and I saw that it said five hours.
SPEAKER_2: This is different from the soap box stats.
SPEAKER_2: Hey, what if we just use soap?
SPEAKER_2: What if we invent the soap box, but like the other soap box?
SPEAKER_1: Tell me about the soap box?
SPEAKER_1: I mean, what is there to tell, right?
SPEAKER_2: You know what it is.
SPEAKER_2: I say soap box, and you got a perfect image in your head.
SPEAKER_1: Is it a box out of soap?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, which is so much better than the dirt box.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I mean, it's gonna keep people's hands clean, you know?
SPEAKER_1: Gotta wash the soap.
SPEAKER_2: Now, the thing about the soap box and the dirt box...
SPEAKER_1: By the way, the soap box and the dirt box is my favorite weird animated movie from the 90s.
SPEAKER_1: It's a great love story.
SPEAKER_3: Wait, it's just the dirt bag and the soap box.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, the dirt bag.
SPEAKER_1: That's even better.
SPEAKER_1: I'll see if we can whip up a dirt bag for him and then we can put the dirt bag in the soap box.
SPEAKER_2: Oh my God.
SPEAKER_2: And if you double package it, then your hands don't get dirty because you clean your hands from the dirt on the soap box.
SPEAKER_2: Don't handle the dirt bag for too long.
SPEAKER_1: No, that one is a concern for sure.
SPEAKER_1: I feel like that's a pretty good solution.
SPEAKER_1: All things told, we have a dolly with doll legs.
SPEAKER_1: We have a dirt bag in a soap box.
SPEAKER_1: That's really all you need to make things safe for people.
SPEAKER_2: Ethical consumption under capitalism.
SPEAKER_1: That's it for ethical consumption under capitalism.
SPEAKER_2: So thinking about...
SPEAKER_1: Can you give me your second craving of our 20 craving extravaganza?
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, thinking about this ethical consumption, I have actually hit this dilemma as well recently.
SPEAKER_2: Because as I am now working from home, that involves me sitting at my computer a lot.
SPEAKER_2: And I am using my office chair, which I have had for...
SPEAKER_2: Well, I was a teenager when I got it.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, wow.
SPEAKER_2: And that's not great.
SPEAKER_2: And like, I can feel that it's not great, if you know what I mean.
SPEAKER_2: So I've been big craving a new office chair.
SPEAKER_2: So what do I look for when I look for an office chair?
SPEAKER_2: Like, how many nozzles does it need?
SPEAKER_2: Do I need the one with NOS?
SPEAKER_2: Does it need to light up?
SPEAKER_1: I think lighting up is an absolute necessity.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, I think the first consideration should be that it lights up.
SPEAKER_1: I think it needs to be able...
SPEAKER_1: You need to be able to choose custom colors.
SPEAKER_2: This is a requirement, yeah.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it really needs to scream gamer.
SPEAKER_1: It needs to like...
SPEAKER_1: When you're doing work, it needs, you know, when you're on a Zoom call or whatever, you need all of the work, all of your fellow, your coworkers.
SPEAKER_2: And this was one of my concerns is, what am I going to do about my coworkers seeing this amazing chair?
SPEAKER_2: What are they going to think?
SPEAKER_2: How do I get a chair that both screams comfort, gamer and professional?
SPEAKER_2: What is the intersection of this Venn diagram?
SPEAKER_1: I think black is the intersection of the first...
SPEAKER_2: Just a normal office chair.
SPEAKER_1: It's got to be black because gamer chairs are black and professional chairs are black.
SPEAKER_2: I feel like if it doesn't have neon green or orange, it's not a real gamer chair.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, I have it.
SPEAKER_1: I have an idea.
SPEAKER_1: Business in the front, party in the back.
SPEAKER_3: I'm going to get the mullet chair.
SPEAKER_1: Get the mullet chair.
SPEAKER_1: Everything that is visible to the camera is boring and black, professional, very all that.
SPEAKER_1: But in the back, it lights up.
SPEAKER_1: It's going crazy.
SPEAKER_2: You've given me the most wonderful idea.
SPEAKER_2: Do you know like a whiteboard that you can flip?
SPEAKER_2: Like it's a two-sided whiteboard and you can flip it.
SPEAKER_2: You know what I'm talking about?
SPEAKER_2: What if that but a chair?
SPEAKER_2: What if you could just entirely flip the back of the chair?
SPEAKER_2: So like one side of it is like neon Genesis, Evangelion side, and then you've got your Madoka side.
SPEAKER_1: What?
SPEAKER_2: Nothing.
SPEAKER_2: You've got your perfectly normal business side, and then you've got your neon side.
SPEAKER_1: I was going to ask you to choose a business-y professional anime.
SPEAKER_1: What is the most professional anime?
SPEAKER_1: What is the anime you can tell your coworkers about?
SPEAKER_2: Oh, God.
SPEAKER_2: What is the anime you can talk...
SPEAKER_2: Dragon Ball?
SPEAKER_1: Naruto.
SPEAKER_2: Naruto.
SPEAKER_3: I don't know.
SPEAKER_2: I don't think Naruto makes the cut.
SPEAKER_2: I think Dragon Ball is like a cultural touchstone, right?
SPEAKER_2: Like everyone knows what a Dragon Ball is.
SPEAKER_1: Are you fucking telling me Naruto is not a cultural touchstone?
SPEAKER_2: I think it's not a cultural touchstone you want your coworkers to know about.
SPEAKER_2: You said, what's the business anime?
SPEAKER_2: And I think Goku...
SPEAKER_2: Goku in a suit, you know?
SPEAKER_2: Goku could fit a suit.
SPEAKER_1: Goku, Goku, he's just in a suit.
SPEAKER_1: He's got his like crazy hair, like combed back, and he's like in...
SPEAKER_1: Oh, my God.
SPEAKER_3: He's like full on Super Saiyan, but he has a comb over.
SPEAKER_1: He's like, oh, hello, I'm here to talk about the report on the Dragon Balls.
SPEAKER_1: I know so much about Dragon Ball, you can tell.
SPEAKER_2: Today, I'm going to talk about supply and demand.
SPEAKER_2: You see, everyone demands the Dragon Balls.
SPEAKER_2: And let me tell you, I have two Dragon Balls, and I can supply you with those, but you're going to have to give me something great.
SPEAKER_2: Anyways, the bidding starts at three wishes.
SPEAKER_1: The thing about the mullet chair is I don't see why you can't take it a step further and have your whole setup be able to just shift at the drop of a hat.
SPEAKER_1: So like your keyboard goes from like being a very normal keyboard to like one that's all light up and gamer and all that.
SPEAKER_1: Your mouse pad goes from being like a nice picture of a beast being one of those that has like the big like fucking weird ass or titty like things.
SPEAKER_3: Oh, God, I knew you were going to say that.
SPEAKER_3: I was like, please say literally anything else.
SPEAKER_3: Like, please say a picture of Naruto.
SPEAKER_2: For God's sake, just don't say exactly what you said.
SPEAKER_1: It's the business picture of Goku, but his ass.
SPEAKER_3: He's leaned over, he's looking behind him.
SPEAKER_1: Both one of the mouse pads is the business picture of Goku looking very normal.
SPEAKER_1: And then that's the business one.
SPEAKER_3: But the thing is, the armrest is the butt on both of them.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, it's perfect.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, God.
SPEAKER_1: Now, let's talk about comfort.
SPEAKER_1: What do you find comfortable in an office chair?
SPEAKER_2: So, you know the anime Death Note?
SPEAKER_1: Death Note, yes.
SPEAKER_1: I'm familiar with Death Note.
SPEAKER_2: Do you know...
SPEAKER_2: Oh, God.
SPEAKER_2: I think his name is L.
SPEAKER_2: He sits in a chair with his legs pulled against him.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, I'm not that familiar with Death Note, but I...
SPEAKER_2: All right, you know the fetal position?
SPEAKER_1: I'm familiar with the fetal position.
SPEAKER_2: You find yourself in it often.
SPEAKER_1: I'm much more familiar with the fetal position.
SPEAKER_2: I sit like that in chairs, like all the time.
SPEAKER_2: And I need a chair that can deal with that.
SPEAKER_2: Because my chair, I do that, like, I sit like that most of the time in my chair.
SPEAKER_2: And most, like, professional high-end business chairs, you cannot do that in, and so they are worse than my shitty $100 chair from 10 years ago.
SPEAKER_1: So here's what I'm thinking.
SPEAKER_1: Leg strap.
SPEAKER_1: It comes out past the armrest, and it's just a band that you can just, like, put past your legs and just have your legs fetal positioned in.
SPEAKER_1: Does this make any sense?
SPEAKER_2: It feels like you mean, like, locking myself into the chair, like a roller coaster.
SPEAKER_1: Yes, basically.
SPEAKER_2: Like, this sounds uncomfortable.
SPEAKER_2: It's like, buckle up, children.
SPEAKER_2: We're going for a ride.
SPEAKER_1: It's comfortable.
SPEAKER_2: Explain.
SPEAKER_2: You're gonna have to explain.
SPEAKER_1: So cocoon comfortable.
SPEAKER_1: This comfortable.
SPEAKER_1: No, okay.
SPEAKER_2: I do want to point out that your body does dissolve if you go into a cocoon, and by you, I mean caterpillars or larvae.
SPEAKER_1: But then you come out of the cocoon, and you're a pretty ass butterfly.
SPEAKER_1: Don't you want wings, Clair?
SPEAKER_1: This is how you get wings.
SPEAKER_2: I don't.
SPEAKER_2: I don't like Red Bull.
SPEAKER_1: Well, I want wings, so I'm gonna get this chair.
SPEAKER_1: And then you're gonna feel so uncool, because I'm gonna be flying, and you're gonna be like, sitting there in your chair doing work.
SPEAKER_2: I think that's also a solution to your craving.
SPEAKER_2: We just got to give everyone wings.
SPEAKER_1: I don't see how that helps at all, either remotely, a little bit.
SPEAKER_1: But you know what, would have given them wings, the Iron Man suit, it's fine.
SPEAKER_2: We just need an Iron Angel suit.
SPEAKER_1: I could be your Iron Angle or your Iron Devil.
SPEAKER_2: Well, you mean your Iron Angel or your Iron Man?
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that's an option, but I guess you hate that for some reason.
SPEAKER_2: I want to be clear, like I do put my legs down sometimes, or I put my legs up, or I like lean back.
SPEAKER_1: That's why you can undo the band.
SPEAKER_2: All right, it kind of sounded like I was in for a ride.
SPEAKER_1: No, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_1: You're in control of the band.
SPEAKER_1: You have a button on your armrest that lets you snap back the band.
SPEAKER_2: I just want like a wide, I sort of just want like a big area to sit in, right?
SPEAKER_2: I want to be able to cross my legs.
SPEAKER_1: Okay, so it's a throne.
SPEAKER_1: It's a throne on wheels.
SPEAKER_2: When I do think of a throne, I think of like a very stiff seat.
SPEAKER_1: But not on this one.
SPEAKER_2: It's like the Game of Thrones throne, but it's made of like pillows or even better, those tubes that you like put in the water and then like are buoyant because of worms.
SPEAKER_2: No, what are those called?
SPEAKER_2: Water tubes, water worms.
SPEAKER_1: Talking about, oh, God, what are they called?
SPEAKER_1: Nope, no knowledge.
SPEAKER_1: Pool Noodle.
SPEAKER_2: Pool Noodle.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, what if it's just made out of pool noodles?
SPEAKER_2: So instead of swords, it's just pool noodles.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, perfect.
SPEAKER_1: Incredible.
SPEAKER_1: I think that's all.
SPEAKER_2: And then you can strap in.
SPEAKER_1: Strap in, you know?
SPEAKER_1: You're the queen now.
SPEAKER_2: I'm the pool noodle queen.
SPEAKER_1: In your gamer chair, your professional gamer chair, mullet chair.
SPEAKER_1: It's still a mullet chair.
SPEAKER_2: I want to leave.
SPEAKER_1: Leadership in the front, party in the back.
SPEAKER_2: What's your craving?
SPEAKER_1: So, as I said, my cravings have an ethical bend to them today.
SPEAKER_1: This one is a craving that I have, though I know it is almost certainly unethical in today's world.
SPEAKER_1: And also, for what it's worth is impossible.
SPEAKER_1: That is birthing children.
SPEAKER_1: Finally, to be able to get pregnant and give birth.
SPEAKER_1: This is just a real genuine craving.
SPEAKER_1: This is one of the first cravings I ever wrote down.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that's a thing that I would love to be able to do.
SPEAKER_1: It's unethical in today's society, I think, to bring more beings into this world that is going down the drain.
SPEAKER_1: Or at least there's ethical considerations.
SPEAKER_1: But it's also physically impossible, so that's fine.
SPEAKER_2: Now, I do want to bring up that there have been trials of transplanting uteruses.
SPEAKER_1: So far, it's been mostly for cis women.
SPEAKER_1: And also, for what it's worth, even if there were that for trans women, my body is fucked enough that I doubt that I would be given much of an opportunity to do such a thing.
SPEAKER_2: Probably not.
SPEAKER_1: These are the sad facts.
SPEAKER_1: The sacks.
SPEAKER_1: That's the sacks.
SPEAKER_1: But if it were possible, that would be just dope.
SPEAKER_1: That would be super duper dope.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, there's so many things here.
SPEAKER_2: What is it about this that you are craving?
SPEAKER_1: There is a dual thing of one on the level of dysphoria, and I would like to be able to get pregnant.
SPEAKER_1: And the other one is I want kids, which is a thing that I can totally do.
SPEAKER_1: I could adopt children.
SPEAKER_1: I don't super duper care about having biological children.
SPEAKER_1: I don't consider it more valuable to have biological children than to have adopted children.
SPEAKER_1: And also, I say I could go adopt children, but there's lots of bias in adoption agencies as to what sort of person is allowed to adopt children.
SPEAKER_1: That's the thing.
SPEAKER_1: Those are both of the things.
SPEAKER_1: I don't know.
SPEAKER_1: There's not really anything funny to say about this craving.
SPEAKER_1: It's just a craving that I had that I wanted to bring up because sometimes you have cravings and there's not really joke slash mean potential.
SPEAKER_1: I don't know.
SPEAKER_1: There's some joke slash mean potential.
SPEAKER_1: We're both trans.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_2: Now, I'd be lying if I said I'd never had this craving, but I'd also be lying if I said I had this craving recently.
SPEAKER_2: And I think the younger generation of trans folks has made me really appreciate what I can do.
SPEAKER_2: And then the rest of the way in terms of dealing with that and getting over that for myself at least was adoption.
SPEAKER_2: And I mean, I speak from a very privileged place where most of the time that's financial, and that is where my privilege mostly lies.
SPEAKER_1: And it's complicated.
SPEAKER_1: There's a lot of bias against disabled folks in terms of taking care of children and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_1: No, yeah, no.
SPEAKER_1: Adoption is totally a thing that when I do eventually have kids, it will be through adoption, hopefully.
SPEAKER_1: And it's totally...
SPEAKER_1: It's a real ass thing.
SPEAKER_1: So the dysphoria.
SPEAKER_2: I don't know if there's a solution to that other than working through and like...
SPEAKER_1: And I think it's a thing that I've mostly worked through.
SPEAKER_1: I've mostly kind of dealt with those feelings.
SPEAKER_1: They just come up every so often now and again, and it's just like, okay, that's a feeling, and I'm gonna pass that.
SPEAKER_1: Hmm.
SPEAKER_1: I feel bad for bringing up a sad craving.
SPEAKER_1: Can we make jokes about this?
SPEAKER_2: We can.
SPEAKER_2: I think we can.
SPEAKER_2: We have the power.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, I could tell you what I immediately thought, like when you first brought it up.
SPEAKER_1: What would you immediately think?
SPEAKER_2: Well, there were two, right?
SPEAKER_2: The first one was like, what if there was like a VR headset slash like...
SPEAKER_1: That sounds wild.
SPEAKER_3: Okay, so you know...
SPEAKER_2: Now, you did say childbirth.
SPEAKER_2: I just want to make clear, like...
SPEAKER_1: Oh, I did specifically say childbirth, uh-huh.
SPEAKER_2: And you know there's those like suits that can like make you experience the pain of childbirth, right?
SPEAKER_2: What if you paired that with VR?
SPEAKER_1: Great, great and terrible.
SPEAKER_2: This is totally feasible.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, no, that's totally doable.
SPEAKER_3: Okay, so Brianna, this is what we do.
SPEAKER_2: So we dope you up for eight months or nine months, depending on if you want an early pregnancy or not.
SPEAKER_3: And then like at the very end...
SPEAKER_1: See section or not.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_2: Well, the thing is we just want to make sure that you're like unsure of reality.
SPEAKER_2: And then at the end of it, we're going to hook you up to this VR headset and make you experience childbirth.
SPEAKER_2: And then we're going to have like a child adopted ready for you, and you're going to have a child.
SPEAKER_2: And so now you've experienced basically the entirety of the process.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, that sounds like a great solution to that.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, it's super normal.
SPEAKER_2: That was kind of a combination of my two was like the thing that makes you feel like you're doing it.
SPEAKER_2: And then also VR, but also like I'm trying to like if you want the experience of like, I was going to say getting pregnant, but you can have that experience.
SPEAKER_2: The experience of like being pregnant.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, we kind of did that.
SPEAKER_2: We went through puberty already twice.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, we did puberty twice.
SPEAKER_1: It was a time.
SPEAKER_1: I want us to consider transhumanist notions of pregnancy.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, you're going to have to elaborate.
SPEAKER_1: So I mostly wanted to talk about transhumanism.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, you're still going to have to elaborate.
SPEAKER_1: So transhumanism is the like field and concept of like a personhood that is past or is not predicated on humanity is like, what is it like to be a person who is not human?
SPEAKER_1: That is, that's the first thing.
SPEAKER_1: And often it involves being a robot.
SPEAKER_1: It's often like a sci-fi thing.
SPEAKER_2: So you want to get robot pregnant?
SPEAKER_1: I'm just saying.
SPEAKER_1: You know what?
SPEAKER_1: I think if you go transhumanist enough, then pregnancy is no longer a thing.
SPEAKER_2: All right, you're going to have to lead me down this path.
SPEAKER_2: Where have you gone?
SPEAKER_1: So if people are no longer human, if everyone is in the future, as they will be in the future, you know, there's all sorts of different considerations of like what it means to be a person, right?
SPEAKER_1: And suddenly, pregnancy is not a core facet of womanhood.
SPEAKER_1: No more dysphoria.
SPEAKER_1: There's also just the thing of we could separate pregnancy from the conception of womanhood.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, I was gonna say that's sort of what is currently occurring.
SPEAKER_1: You're absolutely right.
SPEAKER_1: And also transhumanism is...
SPEAKER_2: All right.
SPEAKER_1: But no, we could just conceive of pregnancy as disconnected from womanhood in a significant enough way so that it's no longer dysphoria inducing and create a new gender structure and a new kind of more inclusive understanding of what gender is.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, we could do that.
SPEAKER_2: That seems like a thing that we somehow haven't done.
SPEAKER_1: How do we do that?
SPEAKER_1: So let's talk about this.
SPEAKER_1: Let's talk about how do we simply make gender better?
SPEAKER_2: I mean, this comes in the concept of like, are we talking about...
SPEAKER_2: God, maybe we've been avoiding this because there's so many like, it's hard to talk about, right?
SPEAKER_2: Because you have the approach of like, gender is psychological, or gender is sociological, or gender is biological, et cetera, et cetera, right?
SPEAKER_2: I don't say I necessarily subscribe to any one or multiple of those.
SPEAKER_2: I'm just saying those are the school of thoughts that are out there.
SPEAKER_2: And often in quote unquote conservative right leaning circles, it's biology that's subscribed to more.
SPEAKER_2: And of course this...
SPEAKER_2: Now I want to be clear.
SPEAKER_2: I'm going to make a point that someone who I don't necessarily enjoy made the point of.
SPEAKER_2: ContraPoints a while ago, who is someone that I watched a couple of videos of when sort of the canceling, the first canceling occurred.
SPEAKER_1: The first canceling.
SPEAKER_1: I just want to pick out the phrase the first canceling.
SPEAKER_1: That's an excellent turn of phrase.
SPEAKER_1: Continue.
SPEAKER_2: And so I was like, okay, my Twitter is blowing up.
SPEAKER_2: I need context.
SPEAKER_2: I need to understand what's going on.
SPEAKER_2: And so one of the videos that she made, there was like one point.
SPEAKER_2: I actually hated the video at large, but there was one point within the video that she said, why do we have to subscribe to any of these sort of trains of thoughts?
SPEAKER_2: Why does it have to be?
SPEAKER_2: Why does it have to be any of them?
SPEAKER_2: Why do we have to explain transness?
SPEAKER_2: Like, why do we have to explain gender?
SPEAKER_2: If you go up to someone and say, hey, I'm gay, more often than not, now people don't go prove it, right?
SPEAKER_2: Or the other side, it's just social isolating.
SPEAKER_1: Not isolating.
SPEAKER_1: Well, scientifically, you have to prove to me.
SPEAKER_2: You have to scientifically prove that you're a lesbian.
SPEAKER_2: But that exists for transness, and that stems from, I think, the theory of gender is newer than the theory of sexuality.
SPEAKER_1: I think that's a very good point.
SPEAKER_1: And I think, you know, there is this conceit that is common among a lot of queer and trans communities of like, oh, you know, the best way to think about gender is like, there is no gender, gender isn't real in any way, which I think is short-sighted.
SPEAKER_2: I don't subscribe to that personally.
SPEAKER_2: I will get political.
SPEAKER_2: I don't subscribe to that.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Salt Cravings is political now.
SPEAKER_1: And one of the things is like, you know, gender is really meaningful for a lot of people in a lot of different ways and in a lot of different understandings of what gender is and what people's own gender is.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah.
SPEAKER_1: I think like, you know, while we can conceive of it as like, oh, gender identity or gender expression or shitheads who think of it as biological.
SPEAKER_1: Like, there can be gender without necessarily having this really systematized way of thinking about gender.
SPEAKER_2: Now, I want to, I want to start.
SPEAKER_2: I want to like sort of dissect one of the things you just said.
SPEAKER_2: You said shitheads who think it's biological.
SPEAKER_2: I think taking biology off the table completely is also short-sighted.
SPEAKER_2: Now, I don't want to get into the like, but I think like...
SPEAKER_1: I'm meaning a very specific type of shithead.
SPEAKER_2: But we live in a society with a hyperfixation on biology, and so therefore, whether or not you want it to, biology will influence your experience of gender, whether or not it dictates how we think of our gender.
SPEAKER_2: I mean, it kind of does, right?
SPEAKER_2: It does.
SPEAKER_2: It absolutely does.
SPEAKER_2: In 2020, transness, as we see it, is influenced by what the generation before us dictated our biology was to us.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, and you know, that's definitely true.
SPEAKER_1: But you know what would make it not true, is if we lived in a transhumanist world in which there was no even biology, in which none of us had bodies.
SPEAKER_2: Okay, you want to become ghosts.
SPEAKER_1: I'm saying, ghost gender.
SPEAKER_2: What's the ghost gender?
SPEAKER_1: Fuck it, ghost gender.
SPEAKER_2: Alright, great, it's ghost gender time.
SPEAKER_1: God, I feel like ghosts are already gendered enough.
SPEAKER_1: You ever think of the gendering of ghosts?
SPEAKER_1: I'm thinking about the gendering of ghosts now.
SPEAKER_1: And the different ways in which male ghosts and female ghosts are conceived of, and also the notion that they're-
SPEAKER_2: What is a female and male ghost?
SPEAKER_2: What does that even mean?
SPEAKER_1: I feel like in general, there is this kind of difference of what-
SPEAKER_2: Because even from a biological standpoint, ghosts don't have biology.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, but there is this kind of notion of, you can see in a lot of representations of what ghosts are, I think that male ghosts and female ghosts are conceived of differently.
SPEAKER_2: But now this is just, I mean, I know we're talking about media because this is where most references to ghosts come from.
SPEAKER_2: But okay, all right.
SPEAKER_2: But I guess I was playing in the realm of, like, what if we're talking about ghosts in real life?
SPEAKER_2: Like, how do you gender a ghost in real life?
SPEAKER_1: That's a great question.
SPEAKER_1: How do you gender a ghost, Clair?
SPEAKER_2: I don't think this falls apart because sociologically, we don't have, well, okay, I shouldn't say we don't have a society of ghosts.
SPEAKER_2: We think of ghosts culturally, and different cultures think of ghosts differently.
SPEAKER_2: So, like, already you've come into contact with the idea of gender as different for ghosts between cultures, which is already a thing, not applied to ghosts.
SPEAKER_2: And that's sociologically.
SPEAKER_2: Biologically, what the fuck is a ghost biologically?
SPEAKER_2: So I'm just going to jump over that one.
SPEAKER_1: I mean, I feel like if there is a biological component, it is the notion that a ghost maintains their gender, their biological gender, into the afterlife.
SPEAKER_2: What the fuck is biologic?
SPEAKER_2: Like...
SPEAKER_1: No, I know, no, I know.
SPEAKER_1: But that is how a lot of people think of it.
SPEAKER_2: But you lose your body.
SPEAKER_2: Yeah, but like, you don't have a body.
SPEAKER_2: So now we're talking about spiritual gender.
SPEAKER_2: What is your spiritual gender, Brianna?
SPEAKER_2: This is the gender you're going to take to as a ghost, right?
SPEAKER_2: Like, maybe I'm a trans woman when I'm alive.
SPEAKER_2: But like, when I die, I'm going to become a different gender, because now this is my spiritual gender.
SPEAKER_1: When I die, I'm going to have the gender of...
SPEAKER_1: I like that vibe.
SPEAKER_1: Let's go with that.
SPEAKER_1: You're going to become Sonic the Hedgehog.
SPEAKER_1: In the afterlife.
SPEAKER_1: You'll be sitting at home.
SPEAKER_1: You'll be sitting at home one day.
SPEAKER_1: And you'll just hear out of the car of your ear, gotta go fast.
SPEAKER_1: You're too slow.
SPEAKER_2: That's actually a little terrifying.
SPEAKER_1: Give me the Sonic the Hedgehog ghost movie.
SPEAKER_1: That'll be one of the movies in the Sonic Cinematic Universe.
SPEAKER_2: Oh my God.
SPEAKER_1: Sonic the Ghost Hog.
SPEAKER_2: When they finally killed Sonic in the final Infinity Sonic Wars, the sequel to that is Sonic Endgame.
SPEAKER_1: Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_2: And then it's the Ghost Wars.
SPEAKER_1: You know, I think in a roundabout way, this kind of solved my craving.
SPEAKER_2: Great.
SPEAKER_1: Because I'm no longer thinking about giving birth, now I'm thinking about Sonic the Ghost Hog.
SPEAKER_2: Uh, don't worry.
SPEAKER_2: If you ever give birth, your child can become Sonic the Birth-
SPEAKER_2: the Birth Hog.
SPEAKER_3: Sonic the Birth Hog.
SPEAKER_1: Sonic the Birth Hog.
SPEAKER_3: Thanks.
SPEAKER_1: I hate it.
SPEAKER_2: Oh, God.
SPEAKER_2: This has been Salt Cravings.
SPEAKER_2: We'll get to the other, I guess, 18.
SPEAKER_1: Don't we have to do-
SPEAKER_1: We said 20 Cravings, right?
SPEAKER_1: Ready?
SPEAKER_2: Three, two, one.
SPEAKER_2: This has been Salt Cravings.
SPEAKER_1: Thank you all for listening.
SPEAKER_1: If you want to, you could follow us on social media at Salt Cravings on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram.
SPEAKER_1: That's where it is.
SPEAKER_2: If you want to leave us a craving that you want us to do for you personally, send us an email over at submissions at saltcravings.com.
SPEAKER_1: Just to clarify, we won't do it personally.
SPEAKER_2: We will whisper into the mic for you and solve it just for you.
SPEAKER_2: And then we'll publish it live.
SPEAKER_1: I think after this week, you can tell that we can solve any cravings.
SPEAKER_1: Serious, funny, whatever.
SPEAKER_2: So I guess give us a dollar over at Patreon because we're so good.
SPEAKER_1: Yeah, give us a dollar over at Patreon.
SPEAKER_1: Leave us a review or a rating on iTunes or your podcast app of choice.
SPEAKER_2: And it says here on this paper that I'm reading that you can now birth both ghosts and hedgehogs at the same time and they will fuse and become a ghost hog.
SPEAKER_2: So I've got, I have good news for you, Brianna.
SPEAKER_1: Oh, this is the best news.
SPEAKER_1: I'm gonna go do that right now.